2015 post UK election discussion

[Prevenger17]

Get in bed with the devil though and you get burnt.

Or molested with a trident.

 

[Tubey]

Sorry, I just can't help victimising the wealthy and invulnerable in society. As opposed to these sponging layabouts:

"

Rosa Davies
5 hrs · Edited ·
I don't think able-bodied people understand the fear and threat and legitimate worry that the results of this election mean for a lot of disabled people. It's not that we're disappointed that our team didn't win. Disability groups I am a member of are literally posting numbers to the Samaritans and other helplines for members to phone.

People care even less than I thought they did. A Tory majority is far worse than expected. They're going to tax disability benefit (the same as reducing it) and they're going to tighten the definition as to who deserves to get it. It's not just money to us, or a pair of new jeans or whatever. It's the difference between leaving your house and not. It's a way to be less disabled by our impairments, a way to try to live our lives as best we can. Making disabled people poorer makes us more disabled. Money is access. It makes the circle labeled Things I Can't Do bigger and Things I Could Do smaller. And that first circle is so big to begin with.

Even if you agree with the idea that making the rich richer helps the poor, what is happening to disabled people in this country helps no one. Marginalising the disabled doesn't somehow improve things for anyone else. It makes it worse for the able-bodied too. Even if you are not caring for, a family member of, or friends with a disabled person, in the words of Richard Herring, "If you’re not disabled now, then one day you might be. When that happens you’ll want to go to the pub or get on public transport. You’ll want to be seen as a person, not as a disability. Purely out of selfishness you should be fighting for disabled rights. If you don’t, you are prejudiced against your future self. And your future self hates you and thinks you’re a [Poor language removed]."

How can we push back? It is important to fight back, to get active. We need to win allies. We need to set up an activist group so that I can get on Channel4 News and swear at a politician live on TV. I don't know what to do but I don't want to be passive."

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Shame on us.

She's not exaggerating either - I've worked with these people, I've seen it. It's a disaster what's about to happen to them.

 

[Clint Planet]

Put yourself in the shoes of the obscenely wealthy for a change

Pah! I'll leave them to their offensively-privileged and dubiously-earned way of life, if you don't mind.

 

[marty mcfly]

@SNova and @harry @Jxg

You do understand that when we are discussing the tories attacking the poor and sick, they are not removing some lazy scruffy chavs who cant be arsed working from benefit street into work ... they are targeting people with crippling illnesses and disablities, people with terminal illnesses like cancer and telling them to find a job or die. Were you aware of this?

We'll see if that's the case. I know enough people who would be effected by that so only time will tell.

 

[Deggo]

Exactly how everyone should vote. Charity begins at home, not in the polling booth.

Obviously the needy and charity are two different things, but the concept is still the same. People should vote in their interests, not in the interests of others.

As for that last bit, that sounds seriously communist. Thankfully the majority of society doesn't agree with it.

I do hope you don't lose your job or interest rates go through the roof and your mortgage is 5 times what it was I really do

 

[blue4eva77]

Can't believe there looking at dropping the min wage

What is the minimum wage in the UK these days. Just curious

 

[marty mcfly]

On the upside, the super-rich are cracking open the caviar and champers tonight.

I think the they crack open the caviar and champers everynight.

With the exception of the bump in the markets I can't see for the life of me how it effects them.

 

[kenada_blue]

Spot on.

The Labour party and it's supporters need to take it on the chin, not make any excuses and sort it out. The SNP may have had a small effect here and there in England, but can't be blamed for Labour's failure. Hiding behind excuses would be awful. If nothing else, the country needs a credible opposition.

All very true

But even the exit polls were completely off, suggesting a tighter result (which is apparently being independently reviewed) due to the marginal swing that didn't favour labour.

The problem there seems to be the previous Lib Dem voters all jumped ship and scattered everywhere other than Labour.

Was never a surprise the SNP gaining what they did. The surprise was that Labour didn't convince the voters who already decided to leave the Lib Dems imo.

The UKIP vote was always going to be high as they played the card that covered disgruntled Labour voters, right wingers who don't have the BNP to back (remember how many votes they received 5 years ago), and disillusioned ex-tories.

The mix is all over the shop. The only constant was the Tory vote.

 

[roydo]

interest rates go through the roof

Which, ironically, would have been more likely with a different result last night.

 

[Tubey]

@SNova and @harry @Jxg

You do understand that when we are discussing the tories attacking the poor and sick, they are not removing some lazy scruffy chavs who cant be arsed working from benefit street into work ... they are targeting people with crippling illnesses and disablities, people with terminal illnesses like cancer and telling them to find a job or die. Were you aware of this?

At most, 2 in every 100 benefit claimants are fraudulent. That means 98 in every 100 are going to be brutalised by this government by those who think every single benefit claimant is taking the piss.

It's a national tragedy what's about to occur. It's not even guesswork either - it IS going to occur, as it's already happening before these horrific further cuts come into play. And for what? Cutting the deficit? Nope - the deficit has rose despite the hardship. For a stronger economy? Nope, it has absolute no bearing on the economy - if anything, the mental health scars from what is going to occur will cost the UK at least double the amount it shamefully makes.

Seriously Tory voters, I get it, you'll be better off in the short term, but you've made a right pigs ear out of this one by not thinking through the horrifying consequences of what's about to happen. You should have seen the words "£12bn cuts to benefits", realised how much that truly is, and automatically not even considered an X in the box for them. It's like advocating state sponsored ideological genocide.

A few extra quid in your pocket simply isn't worth it, if indeed that's what you'll even get.

 

[marty mcfly]

Can't believe there looking at dropping the min wage

Is that a joke? Where did you read that?

 

[daylightrobber]

Hmm. It seems we have different views on democracy.

See, I believe that a a party's vote share should determine their representation in parliament. UKIP got 13% of the vote so they should have 13% of the seats. Hell, if the Greens or bloody CPGB got 13% of the votes they should have 13% of the seats, because that's true democracy. I wouldn't like it but I wouldn't go as far as saying disproportionate representation is a "saving grace of democracy".

The saving grace of our flawed system is that UKIP only won one seat. Yep.
I believe their ideology is bigoted and has no place in our society. Many of their supporters are overtly racist and they spread fear where there is none, playing on insecurities to achieve their goal. Big win for our democratic system last night.

 

[Woolly Blue]

No difference at all?

Well, not none at all, everything has some sort of effect. But it's just too easy to blame everyone and everything for something which is mostly due to mistakes made internally. If the folks at the heart of the party are feeling victimised by the press then there's no hope for them.

They need to rebuild using a bottom up approach, stop patting each other on the back telling each other what good people they are and start to think about how to win an election. Blair and Brown reinvented the party to appeal to the electorate and did a great job of it. It'll be different this time, but it's not enough to win the possession, you need to score more goals than the opposition.

 

[rascal]

Which, ironically, would have been more likely with a different result last night.

The economy will be in chaos again by close of play.

 

[roydo]

The saving grace of our flawed system is that UKIP only won one seat. Yep.
I believe their ideology is bigoted and has no place in our society. Many of their supporters are overtly racist and they spread fear where there is none, playing on insecurities to achieve their goal. Big win for our democratic system last night.

But only if you agree with the result though?