Style of play

Everton should play

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nsno-chris said:
Of course its the managers fault, he trains, coaches, picks the team and tactics; thats why hes the manager, its all his responsibility. Whatever happens on the park comes down to him, if it didn't then why does anybody need a manager.

We had this same disagreement 3 months ago, i watched the team and identified an issue, you said it was form. So i backed off for a couple of months to see, and nothing has changed. The same gameplan every game, the same formation. I said the players looked off, totally different from last year and you disagreed and said it was a poor bit of form, now you're agreeing that players look limp and off so my initial assessment was right.

Something has fundamentally changed from last year, behind the scenes, whether a change in training or they've lost that Sergant Moyes work ethic, I don't know. What i do know is that what i said after the Palace games still stands now
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Far too simplistic a viewpoint for me...theres a huge amount out of a managers control. If you always applied that viewpoint then many decent managers would be sacked before they got a chance to make a change at a club.

Off form, limp or looking off...its the same for me. Then and now. I am still not willing to lay the blame at just the managers door when players are
passing to the oppositions or handing the oppo a free goal without even having to try.

We all agree it doesnt look right just now, and league wise its a bad season however I dont know how people who want the manager out can just ignore the shocking individual decisions that have cost us and knocked our confidence in game after game. Its at least a much a factor in the points total as anything tactical. These things are not an excuse, they quite clearly do make a difference. We have changed things slightly during games, and players move around positions but none of it is going right.
 

We should be playing football that suits our players style of play, getting the most out of £28 million pound signing for example.

Not be playing all possession for the sake of Martinez loving possession!

At first I was all for the possession, but only when we look good with the ball (like last year). This year when we are in possession i'm genuinely almost scared... this feeling cannot be just me.
 
bicycleheader said:
Far too simplistic a viewpoint for me...theres a huge amount out of a managers control. If you always applied that viewpoint then many decent managers would be sacked before they got a chance to make a change at a club.

Off form, limp or looking off...its the same for me. Then and now. I am still not willing to lay the blame at just the managers door when players are
passing to the oppositions or handing the oppo a free goal without even having to try.

We all agree it doesnt look right just now, and league wise its a bad season however I dont know how people who want the manager out can just ignore the shocking individual decisions that have cost us and knocked our confidence in game after game. Its at least a much a factor in the points total as anything tactical. These things are not an excuse, they quite clearly do make a difference. We have changed things slightly during games, and players move around positions but none of it is going right.
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Far to simplistic that the manager trains, coaches, picks the team and formation?? thats the basis of his job, thats what he's employed to do.

Confidence and form should not last 18 games, and if it does, then guess what, things are bleak.

And you think these 2 factors are more important than tactics, give over hahaha.

Form and confidence does not affect 11 players week in week out. The tactics week in week out are wrong, you're the only one who can't see it mate
 

nsno-chris said:
Far to simplistic that the manager trains, coaches, picks the team and formation?? thats the basis of his job, thats what he's employed to do.

Confidence and form should not last 18 games, and if it does, then guess what, things are bleak.

And you think these 2 factors are more important than tactics, give over hahaha.

Form and confidence does not affect 11 players week in week out. The tactics week in week out are wrong, you're the only one who can't see it mate
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I quite obviously wasnt saying that Christopher. I was talking about your policy of laying all blame at the managers door and that everything is his responsibility. I dont agree with that.

There are plenty of examples in football of a bit of luck going your way and then suddenly everything clicks and everything you do comes off. Plenty of these examples have involved half a crap season and half a great season. We saw it sometimes with Moyes. It is clear form and confidence are a huge factor in football. Dont be silly.

You already listed your proposed tactical changes that will make us improve and get results, and I put it to you again that we already try some elements of what you and other people are suggesting but the out of form players arent pulling it off.

You can be no surer than I am what is going wrong, so ...seeing as how we are not currently in a relegation battle and the boss wont cause the club to explode tomorrow, then how about we do what most sensible fans/clubs would do and allow a manager time to see what he can do. That includes if we have a rubbish league season like we have had so far.
 
bicycleheader said:
I dont know. Maybe starting later this season. Maybe starting next season. who knows.

However its not rubbish to say he is young, and to think he may get better.
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Well look at an example, a player from the same Everton school. he was playing for England and scoring goals by 21?????
 
I wish we played more on the counter. Looked awesome against the Arse last season and Wolfsburg away this season. Lukaku seems more effective with that style as well.

Nearly won RS the league last year too.
 
bicycleheader said:
I quite obviously wasnt saying that Christopher. I was talking about your policy of laying all blame at the managers door and that everything is his responsibility. I dont agree with that.

There are plenty of examples in football of a bit of luck going your way and then suddenly everything clicks and everything you do comes off. Plenty of these examples have involved half a crap season and half a great season. We saw it sometimes with Moyes. It is clear form and confidence are a huge factor in football. Dont be silly.

You already listed your proposed tactical changes that will make us improve and get results, and I put it to you again that we already try some elements of what you and other people are suggesting but the out of form players arent pulling it off.

You can be no surer than I am what is going wrong, so ...seeing as how we are not currently in a relegation battle and the boss wont cause the club to explode tomorrow, then how about we do what most sensible fans/clubs would do and allow a manager time to see what he can do. That includes if we have a rubbish league season like we have had so far.
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I'm sorry but we do not change are tactics, launching a ball forward every now and then is a ast resort because no other options are available in front of the player. Pushing the back four forward and compressing the midfield, then moving your front 3 right on top of the oppositions back four and then going direct is a change in tactics, which we don't do. We keep the same line up, hold the same positions and hoof it hoping that lukaku will hold it, this because the opposition is pressing and harrassing us because they know we are incapbale of doing anything else - and guess hwat its working because teams are taking points off for fun.

And come the 2nd January we may be a bit closer to being in a relegation battle, so hold your horses. I've seen many a team teetering like we are, just to be slowly pulled in. So lets ensure we hit the 40 point mark first before we write this season off
 

What always grates me on this style of play debate is that it seems that it is either "pass to death" or "long ball".
Why can't there be a middle ground that mixes both styles.

For what it's worth I'd like to see Lukaku become a selfish b****** and just stick to the centre of the pitch and get into the 18 yard area and more importantly be reacquainted with the 6 yard box.

What worries me about Martinez is that we're fine when in form but when not we're too soft. Not advocating the ex but when we were struggling he would set the team up as difficult to beat with a core of solidity.
 
Mistertonblue said:
What always grates me on this style of play debate is that it seems that it is either "pass to death" or "long ball". Why can't there be a middle ground that mixes both styles.
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Moyes mixed it up with both styles, the notion that he was a total long ball merchant is just total BS.
 
Dymak said:
Revise all you want mate, we played plenty of good footy under Moyes, and it wasn't limited to hoofball at all.
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Every fan and pundit up and down the league could see it, most evertonians could see it.


Big diagonal to felli, felli brings it down, pinear and baines interplay, ball gets whipped in.

Or the occasional moment of brilliance from a flair player like miralles
 

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