New Everton Stadium - Hill Dickinson Stadium


Drico said:
I don't want to be churlish about Coleman. God knows, we need a few Irish players in there - though I wonder what happened the likes of Farrell and Eglington (who, like Seamus, made hundreds of appearances for us in a low period for the club). I think Seamus is popular enough to merit a place. The bigger point I'm making is really that we shouldn't give the players of what has been a demonstrable low for this football club the same status as those who played for what was then a top club. So, by all means, find room for Duncan, Baines, Coleman, and a few others - but ensure that the players of recent sides are kept to a minimum. We have a glorious history. Getting onto Everton Way should be a privilege - not a given. Membership should, overwhelmingly, favour our champions and cup winners. Let's use it to drive standards, not reward mere sentiment (though that should also have a place, albeit a modest one).
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I agree with your point but I wouldn't say Baines was part of a low period for the club. He was often part of sides qualifying for Europe.

Obviously based on success he can't be put in the same category as Pat van Den Hauwe or Ray Wilson though.
 

sw blue said:
There are many who are giants compared to Unsworth if they were looking for someone from the Premier league era.

Coleman, Baines, Cahill, Campbell, Kanchelskis, Jagielka, Pickford.
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…my word, Kanchekskis was a top player but was only her 5mins. I wouldn’t have Unsworth anywhere near an Everton legend but he’s ahead of Kanchelskis in that regard.
 

TraffordBlue said:
I agree with your point but I wouldn't say Baines was part of a low period for the club. He was often part of sides qualifying for Europe.

Obviously based on success he can't be put in the same category as Pat van Den Hauwe or Ray Wilson though.
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It was a period of managed decline where qualifying for Europe was actually a success given the paucity of resources provided to the manager, who worked a minor miracle.

Kenwright then turned that into "achievement" - but it was pyrrhic.
 
For me, I don't think the "Giant" discussion can be over-simplified and so polarised.

I get that some take issue with Unsworth being included as he was a player of limited ability. But he was part of a trophy winning side and has been a big part of the club over a long period albeit with debatable value added. Of course for those fans that have experienced success and had the privilege of watching great players and teams wear the royal blue jersey, honouring players of limited ability and those who haven't won anything feels like celebrating mediocrity. Despite being lucky enough to have experienced the success in the early 80s, I'm not sure I can entirely align with that view.

We haven't won anything for 30 years and many fans will never have tasted true success, but does that mean they didn't have their "heroes" or favourite players? Do clubs who have literally never won anything not have players that they consider giants/heroes/stalwarts worthy of honouring? Does every player who was part of a trophy winning team warrant "Giant" status? Is Matt Jackson more worthy than Baines because he won the 95 FA Cup and Leighton won nothing?

It's surely subjective and personal. Many factors to consider such as ability, success/achievements, length of service etc, but the Ferguson discussion demonstrates that for some it can be something else, an X factor, a certain je ne sais quoi, that elevates that player's status for them. I may not agree, but it's their opinion and it is valid for them.

I would personally put Cahill and Baines ahead of Unsworth although I'm not sure I'd have chosen them for a Giant stone if asked to compile the list myself. I would not take issue with most of the players that have been included but I wasn't lucky enough to see quite a number of them play.

Kanchelskis was a truly world class player and, for a brief time, in an otherwise fairly forgettable period for EFC, set the pitch alight for us and lifted bums off seats. But he only played like 50 times for us and won nothing.

Mike Trebilcock scored twice in the 66 FA Cup final to help us bring home the trophy, was the first black/mixed heritage player to play for us, and the first black/mixed heritage player to score in an FA Cup final. Historically meaningful and successful, but he only made 11 appearances for us.

It's clearly not as simple as it may seem. There are definitely players I think are more worthy of recognition than say Unsworth, but it is my view and I'm not going to argue that it should be everyone else's. 🤷‍♂️
 
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McKindrick Blue said:
For me, I don't think the "Giant" discussion can be over-simplified and so polarised.

I get that some take issue with Unsworth being included as he was a player of limited ability. But he was part of a trophy winning side and has been a big part of the club over a long period albeit with debatable value added. Of course for those fans that have experienced success and had the privilege of watching great players and teams wear the royal blue jersey, honouring players of limited ability and those who haven't won anything feels like celebrating mediocrity. Despite being lucky enough to have experienced the success in the early 80s, I'm not sure I can entirely align with that view.

We haven't won anything for 30 years and many fans will never have tasted true success, but does that mean they didn't have their "heroes" or favourite players? Do clubs who have literally never won anything not have players that they consider giants/heroes/stalwarts worthy of honouring? Does every player who was part of a trophy winning team warrant "Giant" status? Is Matt Jackson more worthy than Baines because he won the 95 FA Cup and Leighton won nothing?

It's surely subjective and personal. Many factors to consider such as ability, success/achievements, length of service etc, but the Ferguson discussion demonstrates that for some it can be something else, an X factor, a certain je ne sais quoi, that elevates that player's status for them. I may not agree, but it's their opinion and it is valid for them.

I would personally put Cahill and Baines ahead of Unsworth although I'm not sure I'd have chosen them for a Giant stone if asked to compile the list myself. I would not take issue with most of the players that have been included but I wasn't lucky enough to see quite a number of them play.

Kanchelskis was a truly world class player and, for a brief time, in an otherwise fairly forgettable period for EFC, set the pitch alight for us and lifted bums off seats. But he only played like 50 times for us and won nothing.

Mike Trebilcock scored twice in the 66 FA Cup final to help us bring home the trophy, was the first black/mixed heritage player to play for us, and the first black/mixed heritage player to score in an FA Cup final. Historically meaningful and successful, but he only made 11 appearances for us.

It's clearly not as simple as it may seem. There are definitely players I think are more worthy of recognition than say Unsworth, but it is my view and I'm not going to argue that it should be everyone else's. 🤷‍♂️
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Really good post mate.
 

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