2024/25 David Moyes

[Daveysgingerlovechild]

Why are so many white liberals white knighting for black men here? Our black Evertonian friends and players' feelings and opinions are the only ones of chief consideration regarding Moyes on this one. Can we hear from them on this please rather than a load of self appointed representatives? You might be surprised to find they have greater concerns worth consideration and would certainly appear to be under-represented among our fanbase.

@davek omg he's called you a friggin liberal.

 

[Brett Angell Delight]

It’s under investigation, going backwards would mean it never even got investigated. Our manager is hardly trying to bury it.

Nobody said he is mate.

We are going backwards insofar as more racists are far more bold and overt in their racism than has been the case for a pretty long time. The issue has never gone away, though there are some - Kemi Badenoch amongst them - who would have you believe it had, and now it's getting worse because nobody wants to hear about it.

There needs to be a lot of uncomfortable conversations had out in the open to even begin to get this issue under control and while it isn't Moyes's JOB (nor that of any player or manager) to start those conversations, I would like to think that he'd do it anyway because it is the right thing to do - again - for somebody with that platform.

 

[wandyr79]

He doesn't obviously condemn racist abuse because he did not, in fact, condemn racist abuse in any significant way when given a clear opportunity to do so.

Is that to say any of this is his fault? No. Does it make him racist? No. Has he done wrong by Doucoure specifically? Almost certainly not.

BUT he is a football manager, in the direct aftermath of a racist incident involving one of his players. When given that airtime and that platform he should be vociferously condemning all racists and making clear he wants the cancer eradicated from the game. Same of EVERY football manager, player, owner, etc when questioned in such circumstances.

I guarantee that if he was asked about the refereeing performance and said "yeah, it wasn't great" and swiftly moved on, there'd be a load of people in here crying that he didn't kick off more and risk a fine, etc, but when he answers a racist question in the same lukewarm way we get treated to a chorus of the ol' classic "Stick To The Football."

I think some people either think racism isn't as much of an issue anymore as it VERY clearly is (and is on the rise) or they just hope it isn't and welcome this kind of swerving of the issue as validation of that belief.

There is a direct quote from him, saying he condemns it, or do I have that wrong?

My issue is the points scoring. As, that is all that needed to be said, in that moment, in that environment. I just feel it extremely harsh to pin this subject on Moyes, in a pre match football press conference. If this was a sit down on one on one personal interview, then it might have gone into more depth on his views and the specific wording of those views, but to expect somebody to do more in that environment is just not on, in my humble opinion.

I mentioned the word 'comfortable'. This is a very serious topic and not all feel they are qualified to say anything other than the basic. Also, if you start with more than the basic you are opening yourself up to further questions, it is a dangerous game to play if you do not feel that you are the person to go into depth on this topic.

 

[Brett Angell Delight]

There is a direct quote from him, saying he condemns it, or do I have that wrong?

My issue is the points scoring. As, that is all that needed to be said, in that moment, in that environment. I just feel it extremely harsh to pin this subject on Moyes, in a pre match football press conference. If this was a sit down on one on one personal interview, then it might have gone into more depth on his views and the specific wording of those views, but to expect somebody to do more in that environment is just not on, in my humble opinion.

I mentioned the word 'comfortable'. This is a very serious topic and not all feel they are qualified to say anything other than the basic. Also, if you start with more than the basic you are opening yourself up to further questions, it is a dangerous game to play if you do not feel that you are the person to go into depth on this topic.

There's no real nuance or scope for tripping himself up, though. If he were to expand on his pretty uninspiring comment and say that racists are not welcome in football and that everything should be done to eradicate them from it, who does he stand to upset? Racists? I'll take it.

To recycle my earlier point:

Everything else aside, if you had a young black aspiring player in one room, and a racist in another, and they both watched that interview, which do you think feels more emboldened to keep going on about their business?

 

[CielosGrises]

There is a direct quote from him, saying he condemns it, or do I have that wrong?

My issue is the points scoring. As, that is all that needed to be said, in that moment, in that environment. I just feel it extremely harsh to pin this subject on Moyes, in a pre match football press conference. If this was a sit down on one on one personal interview, then it might have gone into more depth on his views and the specific wording of those views, but to expect somebody to do more in that environment is just not on, in my humble opinion.

I mentioned the word 'comfortable'. This is a very serious topic and not all feel they are qualified to say anything other than the basic. Also, if you start with more than the basic you are opening yourself up to further questions, it is a dangerous game to play if you do not feel that you are the person to go into depth on this topic.

The abuse is a strategy to divide - it's very effective as we are proving right now.

The effort should be on unmasking the perpetrators which the police should get on with and the clubs should act on too with bans.

 

[COYBL25]

Moyes was playing to the gallery by trying to look statesmanlike: praising Liverpool and their manager. But he allowed admonishing his own player to become a part of that...a player who first and foremost should have been given 100% support in the face of the racial abuse he suffered. But Moyes didn't do that, and he didn't - in my view - because he didn't want to rock the boat with the Kopite media.

It was a house performance.

 

[davek]

Why are so many white liberals white knighting for black men here? Our black Evertonian friends and players' feelings and opinions are the only ones of chief consideration regarding Moyes on this one. Can we hear from them on this please rather than a load of self appointed representatives? You might be surprised to find they have greater concerns worth consideration and would certainly appear to be under-represented among our fanbase.

Why cant it be people who identify as anti-racist (99.9% of this forum) who make a comment?

Makes no sense.

Moyes isn't racist, not at all. No one is saying that and the only one's claiming it's being said are the one's who cant debate an issue so they just play the man instead of the ball.

@Goat @matty1878 @MikeH72

 

[Huyton Layne]

Bit of a contrast. Also opposition being Villa, Spurs, Brighton, Leicester, and that lot. Not just fodder.

 

[Lanolin]

There is a direct quote from him, saying he condemns it, or do I have that wrong?

My issue is the points scoring. As, that is all that needed to be said, in that moment, in that environment. I just feel it extremely harsh to pin this subject on Moyes, in a pre match football press conference. If this was a sit down on one on one personal interview, then it might have gone into more depth on his views and the specific wording of those views, but to expect somebody to do more in that environment is just not on, in my humble opinion.

I mentioned the word 'comfortable'. This is a very serious topic and not all feel they are qualified to say anything other than the basic. Also, if you start with more than the basic you are opening yourself up to further questions, it is a dangerous game to play if you do not feel that you are the person to go into depth on this topic.

The only person using it for point scoring is Dave, and frankly anyone who engages with him as if he means what he says deserves everything they get. Anyone else commenting is literally just saying it was a bit of a half arsed answer, because it was. Nobody's saying he should be ashamed of himself or sacked or whatever, just that ideally he would have been a little bit more vocal on the anti-racism message. People trying to make out like he couldn't have said 'I abhor racism and the fact it's happening in 2025 is absolutely disgusting' because it might have had an impact on a police investigation is honestly a little bit deranged.

 

[Frenk]

Nobody said he is mate.

We are going backwards insofar as more racists are far more bold and overt in their racism than has been the case for a pretty long time. The issue has never gone away, though there are some - Kemi Badenoch amongst them - who would have you believe it had, and now it's getting worse because nobody wants to hear about it.

There needs to be a lot of uncomfortable conversations had out in the open to even begin to get this issue under control and while it isn't Moyes's JOB (nor that of any player or manager) to start those conversations, I would like to think that he'd do it anyway because it is the right thing to do - again - for somebody with that platform.

I get it, you want more of a pro-active response from our manager, fair enough. But, maybe he has been told to not to go into it with both the clubs having released statements condemning it and with it still being under investigation. There has definitely been some finger pointing at Moyes over this, and I can’t get over that it may be because there is a little bit of bad blood based on his past actions with us. I’m not saying you, by the way.

 

[COYBL25]

Why cant it be people who identify as anti-racist (99.9% of this forum) who make a comment?

Makes no sense.

Moyes isn't racist, not at all. No one is saying that and the only one's claiming it's being said are the one's who cant debate an issue so they just play the man instead of the ball.

@Goat @matty1878 @MikeH72

No, it’s just you doing everything you can to try and drag Moyes into the gutter, all so’s you can try to deflect that you’ve been made to look and continue to be made to look like a prize bellend over your love in with Dyche.

#ThankyouGaffer

 

[Brett Angell Delight]

I get it, you want more of a pro-active response from our manager, fair enough. But, maybe he has been told to not to go into it with both the clubs having released statements condemning it and with it still being under investigation. There has definitely been some finger pointing at Moyes over this, and I can’t get over that it may be because there is a little bit of bad blood based on his past actions with us. I’m not saying you, by the way.

Refraining from commenting on the specific investigation, but a good old, full-throated, Mr Mackey style "racism is bad, mmmkay?" wouldn't have gone amiss!!

Don't worry, we all know who you're talking about...

 

[NathDogg]

View attachment 294815

Bit of a contrast. Also opposition being Villa, Spurs, Brighton, Leicester, and that lot. Not just fodder.

Hang on, how’s he even better defensively than Dyche…….

Nar lad, norhavinit mate! Those stats are wrong lad.

 

[wandyr79]

There's no real nuance or scope for tripping himself up, though. If he were to expand on his pretty uninspiring comment and say that racists are not welcome in football and that everything should be done to eradicate them from it, who does he stand to upset? Racists? I'll take it.

To recycle my earlier point:

Everything else aside, if you had a young black aspiring player in one room, and a racist in another, and they both watched that interview, which do you think feels more emboldened to keep going on about their business?

A very fair point.

The question you ask is a difficult one to answer without knowing the full details of the general scenario. Although, I think the answer could very well be the racist would feel emboldened regardless of what a random football manager says and the black player would depend on how they feel the managers opinions are behind closed doors and how the manager treats them as an individual.

 

[wandyr79]

The only person using it for point scoring is Dave, and frankly anyone who engages with him as if he means what he says deserves everything they get. Anyone else commenting is literally just saying it was a bit of a half arsed answer, because it was. Nobody's saying he should be ashamed of himself or sacked or whatever, just that ideally he would have been a little bit more vocal on the anti-racism message. People trying to make out like he couldn't have said 'I abhor racism and the fact it's happening in 2025 is absolutely disgusting' because it might have had an impact on a police investigation is honestly a little bit deranged.

Very true and my post was certainly not aimed at anyone other than that person, in that regards.

I just feel it may not have been needed to be said. I get that everybody wants people to talk about this but as I have alluded to previously, maybe it was Doucoure who asked him not to go into detail. Just finished a book on racism in sport, and it some of it deals with the fact that they just want to play sport. A lot of them protect themselves by shrugging it off. Doucoure may be like this and doesn't want a big deal made out of it, and accepts that the authorities are dealing with it.

We just don't know, and as we have mentioned that person just doesn't want to think of possible nuances in the situation and just wants to go after their latest targeted hate campaign.