Holgate Racially Abused By Firmino - The Guardian

[Big Fat Sam]

I'm not happy it took so long, but can't argue with the findings. I expected it would have been the case.

 

[Saint Domingo]

So the people who jumped the gun and ran their mouths off are not now eating humble pie. What a surprise.

Maybe you should of just showed a bit of patience and you know waited for some actual evidence.

Now it is everyone else's fault, wild conspiracy theories are being thrown about and guess what the same mistakes are being repeated. If anyone has any actual evidence for these wild allegations then please post it is not then just shut up and stop embarrassing yourself and dragging the fan bases name through the mud.

It shouldn't be a race to the bottom.

Your club won the race to the bottom a long time ago. Lectures on being embarassing or dragging the fan base through the mud is rich coming from any Liverpool fan.

 

[davek]

The statement from the FA has basically said there’s not enough evidence to prove he did day it and not enough to prove that Mason made it up either. So in the absence we are left with whether you believe Holgate or Firmino and some of you have all too gleefully jumped on the I told you so train and backed Firmino.

Liverpool backed their player publicly before the inquiry during and after, Liverpool fans maintained their players innocence despite no evidence before during and after. Everton refuses to publicly support Holgate at any point throughout the process and some Everton fans refused to back him too, whether you like it or not this in a nutshell is the fundamental difference between the two teams. Whether it’s this incident or anything else one club and set of fans will stop at nothing to set the narrative the way they want whilst the other club is quite happy for them to do it as they have no interest in competing and as soon as fans question this lack of desire to compete they’re piped down by other fans along the lines of ‘embarassing’ ‘kopite behaviour’ etc.

The FA verdict has changed nothing. We didn’t know before what happened, and the FA have confirmed we never now will. In what should be an impasse though Liverpool backed by the media have claimed a moral victory whilst Everton have turned an impasse into a humiliation for one of their players. Anyone who points this out though is apparently a massive cringe and embarassing.

Just about sums the matter up this.

Even the beauts on deranged RAWK are accepting of the fact that the FA statement does not clear Firmino of having made racist comment, it just says there was insufficient evidence...note: not NO evidence or an absence of evidence.

 

[Dabluez]

Dont see why any humble pie is on the menu. Take a read of the FA statement: it says there was insufficient amounts of evidence. Technically they couldn't charge Firmino because of that.

It;s ambiguous and leaves the question of Firmino's innocence up in the air. It;s just something he'll have to live with.

Or maybe you could just apologise for calling Firmino a neo nazi, a slur you issued with absolutely nothing to back it up, as usual.

As for insufficient evidence you do know the threshold is far lower than a criminal case.

Just admit it you jumped the gun, you used a possible case of racism for your own warped agenda and now when you have no evidence you are looking at garbage like he protests too much. You are an embarrassment to the Club and it's fans mate.

As for something we will have to learn to live with. As if, you will be dredging this up for years.

In short get a life or get some help.

 

[Saint Domingo]

Or maybe you could just apologise for calling Firmino a neo nazi, a slur you issued with absolutely nothing to back it up, as usual.

As for insufficient evidence you do know the threshold is far lower than a criminal case.

Just admit it you jumped the gun, you used a possible case of racism for your own warped agenda and now when you have no evidence you are looking at garbage like he protests too much. You are an embarrassment to the Club and it's fans mate.

As for something we will have to learn to live with. As if, you will be dredging this up for years.

In short get a life or get some help.

Ironic coming from a Liverpool fan.

 

[Dabluez]

Your club won the race to the bottom a long time ago. Lectures on being embarassing or dragging the fan base through the mud is rich coming from any Liverpool fan.

Typical just because you aren't prepared to agree with the mind warping nonsense that you and Dave come out with you are somehow you are branded as a kopite. Go back and read the absolute twisted garbage that you have posted on here. You are an embarrassment to the Club.

Look at the drivel you have posted with no evidence whatsoever and apologise instead of looking to lash out.

 

[davek]

Or maybe you could just apologise for calling Firmino a neo nazi, a slur you issued with absolutely nothing to back it up, as usual.

As for insufficient evidence you do know the threshold is far lower than a criminal case.

Just admit it you jumped the gun, you used a possible case of racism for your own warped agenda and now when you have no evidence you are looking at garbage like he protests too much. You are an embarrassment to the Club and it's fans mate.

As for something we will have to learn to live with. As if, you will be dredging this up for years.

In short get a life or get some help.

I suggest you familiarise yourself with the English language:

insufficient evidence. n. a finding (decision) that the prosecution in a criminal case has not proved the case because they did not present enough convincing evidence.

Evidence was there, just not categorical.

I expect if the tv angles are all shown we'll see that the mouthing of something other than the filthy Puta insult was made by Firmino.

 

[davek]

Btw, the FA making a big deal out of the 'no players heard the insult' stuff: remember the Emre abuse and Howard and Lescott both heard it but the FA did nothing about?

 

[Dabluez]

Ironic coming from a Liverpool fan.

No I am a fellow blue. The sad thing is you are unprepared to debate and are just resorting to slagging people off, exactly the sort of ting that got you into such an entrenched position in the first place. Maybe you should stop digging.

In short it is innocent until proven guilty. Not guilty until proven absolutely, absolutely innocent. Even if he was proven absolutely absolutely innocent you would still stay it was fixed.

We can't slag them off for a victim mentality and then come out with the rubbish you and Dave come out with.

 

[Dabluez]

I suggest you familiarise yourself with the English language:

insufficient evidence. n. a finding (decision) that the prosecution in a criminal case has not proved the case because they did not present enough convincing evidence.

Evidence was there, just not categorical.

I expect if the tv angles are all shown we'll see that the mouthing of something other than the filthy Puta insult was made by Firmino.

It is not a criminal case you oaf it is based upon the balance of probabilities.

 

[davek]

It is not a criminal case you oaf it is based upon the balance of probabilities.

It's the same proposition.

Insufficient evidence - not enough evidence (not NO EVIDENCE at all).

As said, Firmino cant be happy with the outcome as it leaves the question mark hanging over him of "well, if it was insufficiently damning evidence in terms of volume, what exactly is the nature of the evidence the FA DOES have?"

He;s mired in this case now for the rest of his career - a point that no doubt exercises the Kopites and fuels their attacks on Holgate still.

 

[peteblue]

They were never going to do him for this. He could have called him every name under the sun and it still would have been insufficient evidence.........

 

[Neiler]

Time to move on really hopefully there was nothing in it.

Still made up that Holgate pushed him in the stand head first, played Mason,.

 

[Saint Domingo]

No I am a fellow blue. The sad thing is you are unprepared to debate and are just resorting to slagging people off, exactly the sort of ting that got you into such an entrenched position in the first place. Maybe you should stop digging.

In short it is innocent until proven guilty. Not guilty until proven absolutely, absolutely innocent. Even if he was proven absolutely absolutely innocent you would still stay it was fixed.

We can't [Poor language removed] them off for a victim mentality and then come out with the rubbish you and Dave come out with.

I haven’t slagged anyone off. You are the only person resorting to personal name calling. You have trolled Dave on this thread incessantly and now that the FA ruling has confirmed precisely nothing people are supposed to apologise? What for? They’ve not confirmed he didn’t say it they just haven’t got sufficient evidence to say he did unequivocally. It then becomes a question of who do you believe. I maintain that I believe Holgaye wouldn’t react that way if so thing hadn’t of occurred and nothing the FA has said changes that. How is that being an embarrassment to the club?

 

[Bluemangroupie]

@davek you’re genuniely off your head with the stuff you spout. It’s embarrasing. Literally every one of your posts gets more strange than the last.

Holgate heard something racist, 12 other people on the pitch, including our players, did not. Do you not think it is reasonable to presume that he just mid-heard? Which is exactly what the FA’s statement implies.

You say we haven’t supported Holgate. How the hell do you know that? You’re not at the training ground everyday and you do not know what private conversations are taking place. He may have been dropped for some matches, but quite frankly he isn’t anywhere near good enough for us at this present time anyway. We have dropped him for footballing reasons so leave your weird conspiracy theories out of it.

And finally, something of a reoccurring theme, for the love of god stop banging on about Heysel. Point scoring over the death of 39 people is morally obtuse and it makes my eyes bleed. I have never seen anyone come over as so pathetic when you do this. Time to grow up.

I genuinely think you need some form of anger counselling, or just give up football all together. I only hope that you’re not like this in person and it’s just the keyboard that makes you come across as such an awful person.

Mate, you have to understand that as a club we back our own. Even if you think some people aren't necessarily being 100% rational, please understand why that is before going on a rant.

Edit: Also, for both parties here - insufficient evidence can mean a lot of things. There is insufficient evidence that I dress in ladies clothes on the weekend. Still might be totally true. There is also insufficient evidence for the claim that I can shoot lasers from my eyes. Insufficient evidence as a phrase is neither damning nor exonerating