Where does the problem lie?

[JLW]

Allardyce OUT!!!!!!

It tickles the way people say it too soon to be judging him he hasn’t been here long enough, yet they want to give him credit for the 4-0 win over West Ham!!! Nobheads!!

Allardyce OUT!!!!!

 

[TraffordBlue]

I think we need almost half a team full of the best Moyes era type players to cement our place as 'best of the rest' now that we've lost Lukaku. Half our first 11 is actually very good, but we have some major flaws in our team. I often see people saying we have good players and list the first 11 and mention players like Baines based on his ability 4 or 5 years ago. Some of our fans need to accept that Baines and Jagielka are way past their best and are no longer good enough consistently for a top 10 team, let alone one that wants to break in to the top 6. Since they used to be excellent players back during their peak years, they're still capable of putting in some good performances now and then, but they're no longer consistent enough to be considered.

In my opinion, we're missing the quality of the following players at their peak during the Moyes era: Lescott (CB), Baines (LB), Arteta (CM) and Pienaar (LW). Hypothetically, I genuinely believe that if we had those 4 as well as Lukaku we could comfortably challenge for a top 4 place as it would be a very well rounded team rather than the complete mess of a starting 11 we have now which is way too negative in the centre:

---------------------------Pickford---------------------------

Coleman----------Keane-------------Lescott--------Baines


Lennon----------Gana---------------Arteta-----------Pienaar

------------------------Rooney/Sigurdsson--------------------

-------------------------Lukaku--------------------------------


I appreciate long term that Lennon isn't the answer but even the best teams have 1 or 2 players who are in for their hard work more than their quality and with talent like the above alongside him, I think he'd be fine. Likewise Keane has been disappointing but I think there is talent there and he is suffering from playing in this current poor side. You can see from that team how completely lacking we are down our whole left side and having to play a weak Right Back with no left foot as our regular left back is absolutely killing any productivity going forward down that side.

Obviously all of the above is hypothetical but we seriously need to strengthen the positions in bold in order to challenge the top 6. I know Baines and Pienaar had a great partnership but I think out of all of them we lack Arteta's creativity the most. All of the top 6 sides have someone with that star quality - Alli/Eriksen, Hazard, De Bruyne/Silva etc, and for me Arteta at his peak was the closest we had to players like that. Even with a Vardy type player up front rather than Lukaku, with the rest of the team significantly stronger I think 5th/6th would be achievable.

So it's not all negative in my view and we have a lot of young talent and good back up players but those are the positions I feel need strengthening and highlight how far behind the top 6 we are.

 

[Raino85]

I think we need almost half a team full of the best Moyes era type players to cement our place as 'best of the rest' now that we've lost Lukaku. Half our first 11 is actually very good, but we have some major flaws in our team. I often see people saying we have good players and list the first 11 and mention players like Baines based on his ability 4 or 5 years ago. Some of our fans need to accept that Baines and Jagielka are way past their best and are no longer good enough consistently for a top 10 team, let alone one that wants to break in to the top 6. Since they used to be excellent players back during their peak years, they're still capable of putting in some good performances now and then, but they're no longer consistent enough to be considered.

In my opinion, we're missing the quality of the following players at their peak during the Moyes era: Lescott (CB), Baines (LB), Arteta (CM) and Pienaar (LW). Hypothetically, I genuinely believe that if we had those 4 as well as Lukaku we could comfortably challenge for a top 4 place as it would be a very well rounded team rather than the complete mess of a starting 11 we have now which is way too negative in the centre:

---------------------------Pickford---------------------------

Coleman----------Jagielka-------------Lescott--------Baines


Barkley----------Carsley---------------Arteta-----------Pienaar

------------------------Cahill--------------------

-------------------------Lukaku--------------------------------


I appreciate long term that Lennon isn't the answer but even the best teams have 1 or 2 players who are in for their hard work more than their quality and with talent like the above alongside him, I think he'd be fine. Likewise Keane has been disappointing but I think there is talent there and he is suffering from playing in this current poor side. You can see from that team how completely lacking we are down our whole left side and having to play a weak Right Back with no left foot as our regular left back is absolutely killing any productivity going forward down that side.

Obviously all of the above is hypothetical but we seriously need to strengthen the positions in bold in order to challenge the top 6. I know Baines and Pienaar had a great partnership but I think out of all of them we lack Arteta's creativity the most. All of the top 6 sides have someone with that star quality - Alli/Eriksen, Hazard, De Bruyne/Silva etc, and for me Arteta at his peak was the closest we had to players like that. Even with a Vardy type player up front rather than Lukaku, with the rest of the team significantly stronger I think 5th/6th would be achievable.

So it's not all negative in my view and we have a lot of young talent and good back up players but those are the positions I feel need strengthening and highlight how far behind the top 6 we are.

Fixed that for you............if only we had these players we would be challenging, so we are 10 players off but atleast we have pickford

 

[TraffordBlue]

Fixed that for you............if only we had these players we would be challenging, so we are 10 players off but atleast we have pickford

lol

It's typical that under Moyes we were crying out for a goalscorer like Lukaku as the final piece of the jigsaw and once we brought him in, the rest of the 11 went worse. That Moyes side was very close to a top side when everyone was at their best.

 

[Prevenger17]

For me we are really missing Barkley, yes he had bad games but he pushed us up the field and right now we have no one who does that

Aye. He actually had the will to go into the opponent's half of the field, we're lacking in players of that mould atm

 

[seer]

Lack of consistent spine is absolutely the base of the problem. There should be 6-7 instant names on the team sheet (not because they are the best we have, but because they always perform well) with the remaining spaces available for tactical choice and adaptability

In the past we had those players for the spine... Baines, jags, gueye, lescott, arteta, cahill, Howard are all examples who in their time filled those slots.

Right now we have pickford, that's it. The rest are all so inconsistent that there is no foundation to build any kind of tactical desicion making around.