Debt / Loans (Article)

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d4kyxx

d4kyxx

Player Valuation: £20m
This article

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp....ng-riverdance-everton-shadow-investor-mystery

Has completely confused me. Has Moshiri paid off the JG holdings loan, the Barclays overdraft and the prudential loan with this 80m interest free loan?

And was is this new loan in august and why is it needed when Moshiri has funds?

The whole thing confuses me. I still can't believe we are taking out new loans and had all this debt when we always have a net plus balance after transfers lately and the new tv money? Yet look at the amount in loans we have taken out since 2011. Add to that the sale of finch farm. I do question where our money goes!

Can someone clarify which Debts we have? Which loans, overdrafts etc
 

SimonB said:
And where's the Arteta money ffs?
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Ha. We don't help ourselves when you hear one year our account said "other" 20m something which BK couldn't explain.

Definitely questions to be asked about our finances how we consistently get in to more debt, take out more loans... despite sales of the training ground, improved (slightly) shirt deals, net profit player sales, new tv money.. what are we spending it all on to keep needing more finance? And more debt?
 

d4kyxx said:
This article

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp....ng-riverdance-everton-shadow-investor-mystery

Has completely confused me. Has Moshiri paid off the JG holdings loan, the Barclays overdraft and the prudential loan with this 80m interest free loan?

And was is this new loan in august and why is it needed when Moshiri has funds?

The whole thing confuses me. I still can't believe we are taking out new loans and had all this debt when we always have a net plus balance after transfers lately and the new tv money? Yet look at the amount in loans we have taken out since 2011. Add to that the sale of finch farm. I do question where our money goes!

Can someone clarify which Debts we have? Which loans, overdrafts etc
Click to expand...
Very good questions clearly laid out in laymans terms.
Cant think why after paying off the debts only to take out another in August . Was it for Goodisons makeover ?
 
The only explanation for this new loan is that the interest is cheaper to pay than Moshiri having to sell an asset which makes his more money than the interest would be. I get that. However that only makes sense if he didn't have the disposable income. If he doesn't have the disposable income then surely that will affect our transfers?
 
blulouie said:
Very good questions clearly laid out in laymans terms.
Cant think why after paying off the debts only to take out another in August . Was it for Goodisons makeover ?
Click to expand...

Could be a reason.. valid as well. However if true that brings up the question of how we will afford a new stadium? I believed it would be paid for mostly by Moshiri, with part of it coming from an interest free loan from himself
 

d4kyxx said:
This article

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp....ng-riverdance-everton-shadow-investor-mystery

Has completely confused me. Has Moshiri paid off the JG holdings loan, the Barclays overdraft and the prudential loan with this 80m interest free loan?

And was is this new loan in august and why is it needed when Moshiri has funds?

The whole thing confuses me. I still can't believe we are taking out new loans and had all this debt when we always have a net plus balance after transfers lately and the new tv money? Yet look at the amount in loans we have taken out since 2011. Add to that the sale of finch farm. I do question where our money goes!

Can someone clarify which Debts we have? Which loans, overdrafts etc
Click to expand...
Don't believe what woolly says, I'll try.

The article itself is a re-hash of watched toffee questions posed under parliamentary privilege I think, so it's nothing that hasn't been done to death on various threads already. You'll believe what you want in the end.

According to the accounts Post Balance Sheet Events note the loans outstanding for JG (now called Rights and Media Funding Ltd) and Prudential Trustees (long term loan on ticket sales) were both repaid. Cost about 55 mil from memory. The 25 mil remaining -about 16 -18 mil was spent on compo to various parties, Martinez,Southampton, Walsh etc.
Barclays overdraft facility certainly in place, evidenced by the charges at Companies House.
JG/RMF also has 2 charges outstanding one from August 15, one from Aug 16.
The first one (JG) holds a charge on the 16-17 TV money, so although the debt of 35 mil was cleared, the facility can still be used.
The second one is 17-18 money, and the facility exists, but I am not sure if it has been drawn against, so maybe no debt at all.
In short, at the date of the signing off of the accounts, the club had 3 facilities in place, Barclays, and JG/RMF but possibly no debt other than the 80mil to Blue Heaven Holdings Limited (Moshiri's company which holds the 49.9% stake and the oprions to buy further shares)

Just a sidenote on the "extortionate" interest charged on Vibrac/JG/RMF loans. If you look at earlier accounts, Barclays and Investco did a similar arrangement and were charging 8.2% as opposed to 8.8% (at worst).

Kept it simple, so may get pulled for slight anomalies, but that's the gist.
 
hibbo'sclass said:
Don't believe what woolly says, I'll try.

The article itself is a re-hash of watched toffee questions posed under parliamentary privilege I think, so it's nothing that hasn't been done to death on various threads already. You'll believe what you want in the end.

According to the accounts Post Balance Sheet Events note the loans outstanding for JG (now called Rights and Media Funding Ltd) and Prudential Trustees (long term loan on ticket sales) were both repaid. Cost about 55 mil from memory. The 25 mil remaining -about 16 -18 mil was spent on compo to various parties, Martinez,Southampton, Walsh etc.
Barclays overdraft facility certainly in place, evidenced by the charges at Companies House.
JG/RMF also has 2 charges outstanding one from August 15, one from Aug 16.
The first one (JG) holds a charge on the 16-17 TV money, so although the debt of 35 mil was cleared, the facility can still be used.
The second one is 17-18 money, and the facility exists, but I am not sure if it has been drawn against, so maybe no debt at all.
In short, at the date of the signing off of the accounts, the club had 3 facilities in place, Barclays, and JG/RMF but possibly no debt other than the 80mil to Blue Heaven Holdings Limited (Moshiri's company which holds the 49.9% stake and the oprions to buy further shares)

Just a sidenote on the "extortionate" interest charged on Vibrac/JG/RMF loans. If you look at earlier accounts, Barclays and Investco did a similar arrangement and were charging 8.2% as opposed to 8.8% (at worst).

Kept it simple, so may get pulled for slight anomalies, but that's the gist.
Click to expand...

Basically Moshiri has paid the debt off by borrowing us 80m of his own money interest free. So technically the debt still exists I guess but interest free. He has merely consolidated it.

I'd hoped a new owner would have given us the money and not asked for it to be repayed (such as Chelsea and city owners)

However when I think about it as he doesn't own the club only 49.9 percent I understand now why he has simply loaned us the money. Perhaps he will write it off if he took full ownership. If he paid it off in full without loaning it us, it will have benefited all shareholders who won't have invested as much as him which he would probably argue was unfair. So I see the point

Still unsure why a new loan in august was taken out. Unless of course the same is that he is unwilling to use his own money whilst he doesn't have full control and ownership (as again that would benefit other shareholders) when it comes to the sale of the club (hopefully in full to himself)
 
d4kyxx said:
Basically Moshiri has paid the debt off by borrowing us 80m of his own money interest free. So technically the debt still exists I guess but interest free. He has merely consolidated it.

I'd hoped a new owner would have given us the money and not asked for it to be repayed (such as Chelsea and city owners)

However when I think about it as he doesn't own the club only 49.9 percent I understand now why he has simply loaned us the money. Perhaps he will write it off if he took full ownership. If he paid it off in full without loaning it us, it will have benefited all shareholders who won't have invested as much as him which he would probably argue was unfair. So I see the point

Still unsure why a new loan in august was taken out. Unless of course the same is that he is unwilling to use his own money whilst he doesn't have full control and ownership (as again that would benefit other shareholders) when it comes to the sale of the club (hopefully in full to himself)
Click to expand...

He will write off the money we owe him when the money owed is converted to equity in the club and he simply becomes the majority shareholder. What he has done is no different to what Abramovich did at Chelsea when he first arrived.

A new loan wasn't taken out in August. A 'facility' to take out a new loan was arranged. It's believed that this is new stadium related.

There is nothing to be concerned about at all. The club is in the best place it has been in financially wise for about 30 years.
 

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