New Everton Stadium Discussion

[ForeverBlue92]

Personally I liked Meis, I especially appreciated the way he immersed himself with the fans and subsequently produced a design which won overwhelming approval from the support.
I am certain this wouldn’t have happened with a faceless corporate like Pattern.
If planning is granted and the project moves forward this is usually the point where the architects vision will come under pressure from the construction companies overriding pursuit of maximum profit.
All construction firms are by nature aggressive profiteers and will happily ride roughshod over anyone who opposes their rapacious acquisition of money and land.
They will always attempt to simplify any over complex or ‘custom’ designs in preference for more generic or standardised alternatives because it will generally yield them better financial rewards. They will invariably argue for such changes under the guise of reducing costs for the client or time delays, despite the fact that they originally tendered for the job after seeing the original plans.
Obviously if the original design is to have any chance of completion it will have to be robustly defended and you have to question whether a corporate entity like Pattern who already have a cozy relationship with the builder and little intellectual investment in Meis’ design will fight the case sufficiently.
I suspect not.
Worst case scenario is we end up with a generic flat pack stadium ,( with a few twiddly bits ), after all.

Thats my worry - yet some think its boss getting shot of the bloke who wanted to create a world class stadia.

 

[kev]

I totally forgot about the Everton tattoo tbh mate listen im one of the last people to want jobs for the boys its been my biggest annoyance with EFC for years but I genuinely believe he went above and beyond with the designs and really took the time to get a feel for not just Everton but the city and the dock sites heritage.

For me after seeing the likes of DK's jarg designs I feel like the fella really had pride in this project and deserved to have seen it through (thats just my opinion).

I know he's been well paid but for me I think it was more than just money and he genuinely wanted to create a world class stadium for the club - not often you get many who give a toss about EFC these days mate!

He didn't go 'above and beyond' by getting a feel for Everton, the city and the dock sites heritage though.
That was his job (and yes he's done it well)
Thanks Dan.

 

[phil_t98]

I thought Meis has conducted himself realily well up until this point, he is coming across bitter about it all, according to Alan Myers on twitter Meis was offerd a role but didn’t take it, we have to get this stadium done and the way he is acting is unprofessional and not doing his reputation any good. I hope he goes away and thinks about it and comes back with a more professional view. The stadium seems like its gonna get done and that’s what we should be concerned about

 

[davek]

Usually Bill sorts things like this out with a non-disclosure clause in the pay off. Comical it's all coming out.

 

[catcherintherye]

I was never that big a fan of his after I felt he talked us down a bit in some do the church meetings. Talking about how the optimum number of seats is 1 above the number of people you have there as an argument for a smaller capacity. That’s great but why are the most successful clubs in the world building bigger and bigger stadiums Dan? Just kept dodging the capacity question.

It's also a really stupid statement when you consider 2 things;
1) The club has been selling out, every league game for years (despite being rubbish). That indicates quite obviously capacity is far too small.
2) When clubs move, they tend to see an uplift in support. Normally upwards of 50%. Even just cursory research shows this.

 

[davek]

Why do you suddenly care so much?

About human rights? I've always supported human rights.

 

[Pabbers]

People moan when we give ppl jobs based on emotion and “jobs for the boys”.

We have obviously gone through tender / interview phase and decided to go another direction.

This is what most of us wanted....a more hard and cut-throat attitude, is it not!?!

 

[catcherintherye]

Thats my worry - yet some think its boss getting shot of the bloke who wanted to create a world class stadia.

I have only a cursory understanding of this, but my understanding is the "technical" architect is are more hands on, will project manager more and ensure materials are right etc for the stadium. While it's not impossible, I would say it's unlikely they look to massively row back on the original design, they are more in place to ensure the vision gets carried out.

There are lots of reasons for the change. At one end it may just be the club don't feel Meis has the expertise to manage the project having designed it, or that they wanted him to tender for it but he didn't. At the other end, it may be a cost cutting exercise to end up as a mechano type bowl stadium. I would be very surprised if the club allowed for major movement on the Meis design, which was widely popular.

My gut instinct would be, a pressure point may be if there develop cost implications to keep certain aspects of the bespoke nature of the stadia. Thats where a conflict may emerge. I would imagine though, any fundamental shift would be at the behest of the club, as opposed to the architect. I'd be surprised if the club allowed for them to wholly move from the original concept, otherwise it would be pointless engaging Meis in the first instance.

I mean who knows? I think there's plenty of distance left to run on this one. I am sceptical about the stadium, but not for the issue of Dan Meis.

 

[Dougie]

[/QUOTE]

 

[Dougie]

Sorry if already been posted but on the pattern websites under projects it’s got Bramley-Moore Dock stadium everton. So it’s official.

 

[ganistuk]

Everton FC Stadium - Bramley Moore Dock

Pattern Design are Technical Architect on Everton FC's new stadium. Located at Bramley Moore Dock, a UNESCO World Heritage site in North Liverpool.

www.pattern-architects.com

If you read the blurb, they say that they were invited by the club to win planning and have experience of Heritage sites. Also says the design team was led by Meis. There are many more aspects to this project, many of which I suspect Meis and his team are not the best qualified to deliver.

 

[evertony]

I reckon he’s just been furloughed to save a few months of salary.......

 

[blulouie]

When the dust settles and he and the club come to their sense's he will be there on opening day taking the plaudits.

 

[davek]

I know Meis is feeling aggrieved right now, but it'll be interesting to see as the stadium process develops he keeps on tweeting his views on how it's possibly veering away from his vision. Stuff like this is usually capped off with non-disclosure clauses, but it's obvious Meis is playing that game.

This will run and run.

 

[Jacko93]

I agree with you alot mate but he's been shafted here - poor from the club and something underhand you would expect from the scum across the park.

Its not underhand at all. It is standard business in UK construction.

There is no issue here.