Confirmed Signing Merlin Rohl

Status
Not open for further replies.

hetion said:
That's why good stats can be a lot less misleading 😉

He's not, that sort of thing is accounted for in more in-depth stats. But you're absolutely right - that's exactly why taking a stat like pass completion % without context can be super misleading! You don't know if it's because they're crap, or because they're attempting a lot of high risk, high reward passes.
Click to expand...
Do they have a stat for how good the pass? For example, KDH found NDiaye with a forward final third pass on Saturday which from a stats perspective would be a tick but anyone who watched the game know it was a poor pass because it was behind him and basically butchered a goal scoring opportunity. From a football perspective it would have been better to risk an interception by playing the ball further in front of him since that was our best chance of scoring but from a stats perspective its more likely to go down as an inaccurate pass. Just a small example of why there is absolutely no substitute for actually watching players play. It's the only way to put stats into context but also to get a feeling if stats are transferable to a different league/level. I might be an extremely good dribbler at League 1 Level but at Premier League Level I might not succeed in a single dribble.
 

Would be great if this guy could play a little deeper. Give us some big presence in the middle of the pitch, win the ball pass it on, or every now and again drive us up there with the legs to get back afterwards!

Rohl, JOB, JB, Tarks, Barry all will be a massive threat on set pieces.
 
Kevsleftpeg said:
Do they have a stat for how good the pass? For example, KDH found NDiaye with a forward final third pass on Saturday which from a stats perspective would be a tick but anyone who watched the game know it was a poor pass because it was behind him and basically butchered a goal scoring opportunity. From a football perspective it would have been better to risk an interception by playing the ball further in front of him since that was our best chance of scoring but from a stats perspective its more likely to go down as an inaccurate pass. Just a small example of why there is absolutely no substitute for actually watching players play. It's the only way to put stats into context but also to get a feeling if stats are transferable to a different league/level. I might be an extremely good dribbler at League 1 Level but at Premier League Level I might not succeed in a single dribble.
Click to expand...
Yeah definitely not a substitute for watching players play! You absolutely need both.

And I can't even begin to explain how advanced stats are these days. It's come so, so far from assists, key passes, even xG and xA are about at the bottom of complexity now in terms of what is recorded and analysed. All the things you mentioned can be encapsulated in stats. Positional data of all players on the pitch at the time of the pass, potential threat of the pass, likely value of the pass compared to the actual outcome, loads more - it's so far beyond just a tick because a pass got completed. Things like quality of league etc is all taken into account too.

Anyway I'm waffling and this is off topic but I don't think there's anything in data versus eye test. You need to do both at an extremely high level to recruit effectively at the top level of football. Just as someone can be a great scout and a terrible scout, you can use data really well or really badly.
 
hetion said:
Yeah definitely not a substitute for watching players play! You absolutely need both.

And I can't even begin to explain how advanced stats are these days. It's come so, so far from assists, key passes, even xG and xA are about at the bottom of complexity now in terms of what is recorded and analysed. All the things you mentioned can be encapsulated in stats. Positional data of all players on the pitch at the time of the pass, potential threat of the pass, likely value of the pass compared to the actual outcome, loads more - it's so far beyond just a tick because a pass got completed. Things like quality of league etc is all taken into account too.

Anyway I'm waffling and this is off topic but I don't think there's anything in data versus eye test. You need to do both at an extremely high level to recruit effectively at the top level of football. Just as someone can be a great scout and a terrible scout, you can use data really well or really badly.
Click to expand...

Much like VAR, the technology itself isn't the problem but it won't work as it should if you have morons using/interpreting it.
 

Kevsleftpeg said:
Do they have a stat for how good the pass? For example, KDH found NDiaye with a forward final third pass on Saturday which from a stats perspective would be a tick but anyone who watched the game know it was a poor pass because it was behind him and basically butchered a goal scoring opportunity. From a football perspective it would have been better to risk an interception by playing the ball further in front of him since that was our best chance of scoring but from a stats perspective its more likely to go down as an inaccurate pass. Just a small example of why there is absolutely no substitute for actually watching players play. It's the only way to put stats into context but also to get a feeling if stats are transferable to a different league/level. I might be an extremely good dribbler at League 1 Level but at Premier League Level I might not succeed in a single dribble.
Click to expand...
A lot of the stats that top sides have access to now are far more advanced than that.

I read the book by the Liverpool data guy while I was sat round a pool this summer and while it was nauseating in parts (although I particularly liked the bit about Ian Ayre trying to buy Lukaku from us), it was eye opening about the sort of data they have access to. To the point that they now analyse a players nobody position as they receive a pass etc and have data for it.
 

Attachments

  • OIP.webp
    OIP.webp
    32.7 KB · Views: 1

Status
Not open for further replies.

Welcome

Join Grand Old Team to get involved in the Everton discussion. Signing up is quick, easy, and completely free.

Register

Shop

Back
Top