New Everton Stadium Discussion

The design is a compromise reflecting multiple factors including:

1. Site geometry for N/S pitch
2. Planning constraints
3. Fanbase demographics including wealth distribution
4. Buildability
5. Affordability

Some of the compromises hurt aesthetics (roof height/shape). Some hurt capacity (North Stand footprint, scaled down South) and some limit economics (overall capacity, limited boxes).

IMO some of these compromises have possible silver linings. The smaller North Stand will somewhat echo the Park Stand (current and historic) and create a more distinctive ‘feel’. Boxes are atmosphere destroyers at eg Wembley, Emirates so preferring Loge seats may help overall atmosphere. The club has to get the outside aesthetics right as that will drive interest way beyond football. Inside it has to provide PL standard fan facilities, albeit without the palatial excesses of Spurs.

Goodison has design elements that limit atmospherics (the Park End being particularly risible). Every stadia has compromises. We will do more to determine how good or otherwise it is in this respect, recognising the imperfections are real and need to be overcome but nothing in life is perfect.

I have waited thirty years for us to deliver a new stadium. This location and this design tick far more boxes than they miss for me. Fans of other teams I know here in North London are at best vaguely aware of BMD but when I show them my phone screensaver the reaction is a consistent ‘Wow’. Maybe we are getting too close too it to realise that externally at least it has that impact as rendered?

Finally, I think Tom generally makes terrific, expert points but I disagree with his view that externals are less important than internals. They are equally important. The former in terms of visibility, commercial interest and overall reputation. The latter for the match day fan.

Will BMD deliver on both? Time will tell but hopefully we will still be part of a positive answer on match days, not just passive consumer-age nu-fans.
 
For me the reservations are slight..... but we do this only once and at great expense, so I think it's fair to be able to express those concerns.

It is a relatively basic bowl. The original had 3 tiers on the sides. There is no overlapping of tiers to reduce viewing distances or give greater capacity per footprint... in plan view all stands are straight fronted. Even the corners are straight cranked sections, not curved as at say the Etihad. For the capacity, the configuration could only be more basic if it was one continuous single tier bowl. If it was the original East-West configuration, all sides probably would've been equal height. The overlay shown previously was only for North-South layouts.

As regards boxes. They still represent the ultimate in luxury and income. Arsenal have approx 146. Spurs have 80 large exec boxes, Villa have over 100, Liverpool have over 60. We have just 22 (I think). That is a massive disparity and if were supposed to maximising income it is slightly puzzling. Those other stadia also have whole elevated corporate tiers offering more exclusive and superior views. Our location might've also made boxes convertible to all-year-round hotel suites..... I don't think Loge suites offer similar flexibility nor revenue streams.
Mate you wanted to put lipstick on GP
 
It's not "putting downers" on something by stating some simple facts or making direct comparisons. If it is, then perhaps all isn't what it says on the tin. Nothing whatsoever to do with positivity or negativity.
Quick question about said ‘facts’. You state we risk having a ‘fur coat with no knickers’.. I wonder if you really understand our fan base? You quote Arsenal having loads of exec boxes etc? As if that’s a good thing for atmosphere? Having prawn sandwich brigade watch us enjoy ourselves whilst not adding to the atmosphere? Just seems odd. This is a football stadium and I want it loud and focussed on football not some corporate day outs.

As regards boxes. They still represent the ultimate in luxury and income. Arsenal have approx 146. Spurs have 80 large exec boxes, Villa have over 100, Liverpool have over 60. We have just 22 (I think)

I’d argue that there is direct correlation with those with higher exec boxes and those with worse atmosphere.. (Arsenal Library??)

Can’t have it both ways mate and I for one am glad that our design is focused on normal everyday fans that the majority of us are
 

Quick question about said ‘facts’. You state we risk having a ‘fur coat with no knickers’.. I wonder if you really understand our fan base? You quote Arsenal having loads of exec boxes etc? As if that’s a good thing for atmosphere? Having prawn sandwich brigade watch us enjoy ourselves whilst not adding to the atmosphere? Just seems odd. This is a football stadium and I want it loud and focussed on football not some corporate day outs.



I’d argue that there is direct correlation with those with higher exec boxes and those with worse atmosphere.. (Arsenal Library??)

Can’t have it both ways mate and I for one am glad that our design is focused on normal everyday fans that the majority of us are

Where have I mentioned boxes in relation to atmosphere.... but I don't disagree? However, the point is boxes increase revenue and help pay for the whole thing quicker. They are a necessary evil for all new stadium projects. Where they are put is what affects the atmosphere. The Millenium has plenty of them...... the atmosphere is as good as for any stadium in the world.
 
Where have I mentioned boxes in relation to atmosphere.... but I don't disagree? However, the point is boxes increase revenue and help pay for the whole thing quicker. They are a necessary evil for all new stadium projects. Where they are put is what affects the atmosphere. The Millenium has plenty of them...... the atmosphere is as good as for any stadium in the world.
Reason the millennium has that atmosphere is the beer Tom;-) as a Welshman I can attest to that!
It appears as though you think the inside will be a bit of a let down compared to Spurs/Arsenal etc, which it might be for some individuals.. my point is that normal match going fans would probably prefer a bear pit.. the dortmund stadium is famed for noise.. I’d rather that than aesthetics personally.. and ultimate what would help the team more? Glass boxes or people and passion?
 

Well, if you think we'll struggle to find the money to build version 2 of the BMD, just as well as we didn't build the original 60,000 version then, isn't it?

I don't disagree....

However, the more pertinent point is even several years in, none of us have any idea how we're paying for it. So far it's been wealthy benefactor(s) and blind faith only. That might've all changed, hence talk of new owners just as the first phase is completed.
 
Reason the millennium has that atmosphere is the beer Tom;-) as a Welshman I can attest to that!
It appears as though you think the inside will be a bit of a let down compared to Spurs/Arsenal etc, which it might be for some individuals.. my point is that normal match going fans would probably prefer a bear pit.. the dortmund stadium is famed for noise.. I’d rather that than aesthetics personally.. and ultimate what would help the team more? Glass boxes or people and passion?
Again.... i can't disagree about the beer factor or the glass versus fans.... but it also has a lot to do with the larger upper tiers and closing roof.

Spurs is also a different animal to the Emirates. Far better proportions.

The Dortmund analogy holds a lot of water but the roof geometry is different and the capacity is much larger with tread depths that allow 2:1 capacity uplift. We've gone with 750mm which can't yield that ratio.
 

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