New Everton Stadium - Hill Dickinson Stadium

[VentureBrosEFC]

Not sure Sun tan bob mentioned it but it's in the council report which is being voted on.

It's in his quotes.

"To get that certainty, and ensure the stadium is affordable, we need to confirm stadium design, capacity and configuration. And to do that, we need to talk to fans, partners and all stakeholders in the project."

 

[ALANSTUBBS]

Bit underwhelmed tbh.

What we have, in essence, is a location.

Least were not Villa

 

[MrGrumpy]

So the current thinking is,

- Everton secure funding through a borrower 300+mill.
- The Council go guarantor.
- Everton build the stadium.
- The Council take ownership of the stadium on completion.
- The council lease to Everton for 40 years.
- Everton pay back 4 mill a year for 40 years.
- Everton take ownership of the Stadium in 40 years time.

So in essence Everton have to borrow 300+ mill and give the council 160 mill over 40 years.

Total (conservative cost) 460 mill.

No

Everton get a 300 mil loan that they pay bk 10 mil a year over 40 years, as the council have given us the ability to get cheaper funding we pay them 4.4 mil a year.

We own the stadium, the stadium is ours

 

[catcherintherye]

Until we paid them whatever sum is agreed in the contract they whoever finances it would own it.

I honestly think this is smoke and mirrors to have one of moshiris/usmanovs companies to fund it to get around the rules. In gangster terms the council are a front company being used to funnel money through

How would that work mate? You are brighter than me! If you don't want it put out for public reading feel free to PM (it would br greatly appreciated). How would using the council and making Everton appear as tenants allow for say Usmanov to be involved?

If that were the case, would we be likely paying off any of the capital? It looks like we are liable to only interest payments currently.

 

[jinkyali]

It's classic Elstone. Long term and prudent.
Safe option. Sensible.
What I wouldn't be surprised with is if there is an exit clause on EFC behalf to terminate lease once built.
Makes it easier to get initial ground off running and no public outcry.

 

[jinkyali]

No

Everton get a 300 mil loan that they pay bk 10 mil a year over 40 years, as the council have given us the ability to get cheaper funding we pay them 4.4 mil a year.

We own the stadium, the stadium is ours

Known as a finance lease I believe in accounting terms

 

[catcherintherye]

No

Everton get a 300 mil loan that they pay bk 10 mil a year over 40 years, as the council have given us the ability to get cheaper funding we pay them 4.4 mil a year.

We own the stadium, the stadium is ours

So who are we paying the loan back to mate? I understand if it's like a mortgage, and the council are a holding firm to help get us a better deal. I wonder who's lending the 300 million initially, or is this still to be decided?

 

[Lee Smith]

Am i right in this:

- What we currently have is a deal in place to buy the land, no one can buy it apart from us and Peel con not change their mind or drive the price up
- We can (in few months) withdraw from the deal if we changed our mind without paying a penny
- The club will now decide the capacity and design and will consult the fans about it
- Once the design and capacity are agreed, the club will know how much will it cost, the club will then get the money needed and then buy the land and start the constructions

The only thing unclear is that since we don't have a plan yet (design and capacity) we don't know how much will it cost, a 50K stadium will cost something and a 65K stadium will cost much more, so how come they are talking about 300M and how many years and how much we will pay for it?

Mate, don't be fooled by Elstone's talk of not having a design or plans yet, Dan Meis has been involved in this for ages now, I'm confident that we have plenty of plans / designs in place already and a lot of this talk is just to dampen expectations. Behind the scenes there would have been massive amounts of work going ahead, I'm sure of that. EFC are probably acutely aware of the last time we released plans too early (Kings Dock / Kirkby) before all the finer details were resolved and are now just keeping their powder keg dry

 

[Jack1882]

I think you are spot on in that mate. I do wonder if the smoke and daggers is an elaborate way to have a certain Russian involved though?

As an aside, I read Levy was looking for 400 million from naming rights for your new place. Is there any truth in that? Any idea over what time frame?

Really I wouldn't pay too much attention to the rumours going around. He's definately looking to sell the naming rights but there's no reliable info on price. I would imagine it would be for 20 years or so similar to The Etihad and The Emirates.

The club seem to be gearing up to announce that it is the last season at WHL though, they have been inviting every legend still alive to the stadium recently and recording fair well videos etc.

 

[davek]

Obviously we won't default on payment, all this is a bit of a mouthful like:

Security Package

The proposed security package comprises:

EFC opening two bank accounts in EFC’s name, but charged in favour of the LCC SPV.  The first account (Cash Flow Account) will be used as security for the payment of the rent in the Occupational Lease by EFC. All season ticket revenue, hospitality fees and naming rights income will be credited to this account. EFC are only entitled to access and use the funds once the rent for the forthcoming year has been paid. It is proposed if EFC is relegated from the Premier League and for as long as EFC are not in the Premier League, they will be required to credit a significant sum of the season ticket revenue (excluding hospitality membership fees and naming rights income) to this account.  The second account (Rent Deposit Account) will be used as security for performance of EFC’s obligations under the Occupational Lease. EFC will be required to make annual payments to the Rent Deposit Account for the first five years of the term of the lease. All interest which accrues on the deposit remain in the account. If EFC is relegated, then they will be required to top up the Rent Depo

It's like the deal brokered for the long term debt 'securitization' loan which we just got out of. It looks draconian but as long as you keep paying...

 

[catcherintherye]

It's classic Elstone. Long term and prudent.
Safe option. Sensible.
What I wouldn't be surprised with is if there is an exit clause on EFC behalf to terminate lease once built.
Makes it easier to get initial ground off running and no public outcry.

Why would it make it less likely to have an outcry at first mate? And why wold we want to terminate the agreement?

 

[Efcjake]

Just a couple of questions for those brighter than me on this.

1) We pay the council 4.4 million over 40 years. So around 170 million? Presumably this is the interest in order to guarantee the loan (and have preferential rates etc).

Not interest, more of a "facilitator fee". They help us secure the loan and out of the savings we make off of lower interest payments we throw them a thank you payment for holding the liability.

2) At around a 4% rate, 300 million paid back over 40 years would cost us about 15 million a year. Will the capital repayment e around 10 million a year if the interest is 4.4 (in line with how a mortgage from a bank might be?)

Something like that, be arsed checking the maths right now.

3) Who will we be repaying the capital too? Who is the loan too? Private funders? Moshiri? Usmanov? Usmanov company?

The Liverpool City Council. They hold the debt and fund the stadium. We pay them the fees for the interest and repayments as well as the "facilitator fee" mentioned in question 1.

4) Will we have to pay an annual fee to reduce the capital owed? Is it more flexible than that and we can pay more or less over time? If we just repay the interest, after 40 years we will surely still owe the 300 million on the ground?

Yes, like your mortgage payments. Part of it goes to interest part goes to paying off the principal. That will be arranged with whatever organization provides financing to Liverpool City Council and Everton.

5) How will we fund our side of it? I saw Spurs were looking to attract 400 million pounds in naming rights. That seems very high, probably a bit out of our reach currently. But could we raise 200 million for a long term ground name sponsor? Player trading to help fund paying off the capital?

It can come out of Moshiri's pockets as an investment. Could be naming rights, corporate boxes, higher ticket revenue. There's lots of options to explore and opportunity for potential revenue growth that doesn't require selling players.

I'm not sure we'll have any concrete answers to the above. I appreciate some of the points are a bit difficult to answer immediately. If people can answer what they can I'd really appreciate that.

Answers as best as I can in bold.

 

[Darth Toffeeman]

That's not true. Even Damo knows that we can spend whatever we want on "Infrastructure" without it affecting FFP. Capital losses from investing in non-playing staff related costs don't come into it.

Anyone else

I have no idea tbh about FFP, I was just thinking out loud.
Whole thing stinks though and was set up to keep certain clubs at the top table once Man City fast tracked their way in.

 

[bluestevon]

Is it £4.4m per year we are paying LCC just for being guarantor.

Read @toffee_laura post mate, think about the way finch farms bent around certain players involvement in the club, things make more sense when you think outside the box.

 

[navidson]

Why are people taking this 50k number so seriously? I know it's sun tan Bob but in his statement he made mention of fan consultation with regards to final plans.

Make sure you make your feelings know when asked.

59% of fans voted to move to Kirkby