2024/25 Sean Dyche - Sacked

[JLW]

That's why you call it 'steadying the ship' rather than 'powering the ship towards it's destination' though. At the time he came in we were looking like an absolute disaster zone, having stayed up by the skin of our teeth in 20/21 and then being 19th past the midway point of 21/22 having picked up 1 point from our last 7 games. If keeping us up, finishing 12th, and then being 16th at this point doesn't count as steadying the ship then we're really just not looking at it objectively at all. This is, once again, where it just becomes daft. Acknowledging that he's steadied the ship doesn't mean you have to start calling yourself a Dychette, you can still aim all of the valid criticisms at him while accepting that he's done that. Refusing to do it honestly just comes across a bit deranged.

Steading the ship means make us comfortable, we are far from comfortable.

Benitez and Lampard were both punted and rightly so for their long winless runs and league position, whats the difference with Dyche?
He's had longer to work with his players, he's had longer to implement his style, he's had longer to prove his methods are better than the previous managers.

Nothing has changed in fact i would say its worse because he has been given more time and yet we have people backing his corner.
For every game he is here we are taking a huge risk of relegation.

We will never agree on this and thats fine mate, i just cant wait for the day he's gone and for some manager with half a clue to get these players playing closer to their ability.

 

[Gilbert..]

It's basically because we don't have any players who can score goals.

There is an element of truth in that. But his 10 year record at Burnley was less than a goal per game. Over 10 years that takes some doing.
The fella is literally on record saying how much he loves a 0-0.

 

[Lanolin]

Steading the ship means make us comfortable, we are far from comfortable.

Benitez and Lampard were both punted and rightly so for their long winless runs and league position, whats the difference with Dyche?
He's had longer to work with his players, he's had longer to implement his style, he's had longer to prove his methods are better than the previous managers.

Nothing has changed in fact i would say its worse because he has been given more time and yet we have people backing his corner.
For every game he is here we are taking a huge risk of relegation.

We will never agree on this and thats fine mate, i just cant wait for the day he's gone and for some manager with half a clue to get these players playing closer to their ability.

I suppose it's a subjective definition. For me steadying the ship means stop us from plummeting downwards and put us back on an even keel, and I think anyone who doesn't accept that he at least did that for the first season and a half is taking their agenda to a bit of crazy level. If going from 19th to 12th isn't steadying the ship then expectations have gone a little bit haywire.

I've said before, he could easily have been sacked for the winless run last season, and he's sailing close to the wind this season. As I always say with this, I don't think he's a great manager or we're lucky to have him or nobody else could do what he's done, I just think he's done a decent job in the main all things considered. I look forward to him leaving too, but if we still have these players as the core of the squad I don't think we'll see a massive improvement on the pitch. Your faith in the likes of Harrison, Lindstrom, Doucoure, Mykolenko Beto etc suddenly looking boss because we appoint Carlos Corberan or something is genuinely nice to see, but I fear it's sadly misplaced.

 

[NeilMorepies]

you chat bubbles

You’ve been Michael Jackson for months mate.

 

[DualityNSNO]

I suppose it's a subjective definition. For me steadying the ship means stop us from plummeting downwards and put us back on an even keel, and I think anyone who doesn't accept that he at least did that for the first season and a half is taking their agenda to a bit of crazy level. If going from 19th to 12th isn't steadying the ship then expectations have gone a little bit haywire.

I've said before, he could easily have been sacked for the winless run last season, and he's sailing close to the wind this season. As I always say with this, I don't think he's a great manager or we're lucky to have him or nobody else could do what he's done, I just think he's done a decent job in the main all things considered. I look forward to him leaving too, but if we still have these players as the core of the squad I don't think we'll see a massive improvement on the pitch. Your faith in the likes of Harrison, Lindstrom, Doucoure, Mykolenko Beto etc suddenly looking boss because we appoint Carlos Corberan or something is genuinely nice to see, but I fear it's sadly misplaced.

His own expectations as defined by him, despite fluking 12th, are "avoid relegation again" - further proving 12th was a fluke - and that's a problem in itself. He steadied the ship at first, as you say, but then punched holes in the hull himself, so now it just fills with water slower than before.

These players played *okay* football for Lampard and looked competent, but lacking solidity at the back - Dyche came in and fixed that but is utter turd at anything else as it was already known from before he even came to us. It's not unreasonable to think that anyone with any kind of managerial nous isn't able to implement at least a solid but direct approach with these players, not just hoof and hope - you know, actual pragmatism, not what Dyche mislabels as pragmatism.

Also Doucoure is likely either back in the water carrier role or benched/out of the team for any other manager.

 

[Delargeinho]

His own expectations as defined by him, despite fluking 12th, are "avoid relegation again" - further proving 12th was a fluke - and that's a problem in itself. He steadied the ship at first, as you say, but then punched holes in the hull himself, so now it just fills with water slower than before.

These players played *okay* football for Lampard and looked competent, but lacking solidity at the back - Dyche came in and fixed that but is utter turd at anything else as it was already known from before he even came to us. It's not unreasonable to think that anyone with any kind of managerial nous isn't able to implement at least a solid but direct approach with these players, not just hoof and hope - you know, actual pragmatism, not what Dyche mislabels as pragmatism.

Also Doucoure is likely either back in the water carrier role or benched/out of the team for any other manager.

We've stayed with a clean sheet in 6/9 games since October that's really good, but also stayed without a goal in 6/9 prem games, 4 in a row including games against a very bad in shape West Ham, outnumbered Brentford or winless Southampton.

As you said what showed to be a problem at Everton in the last few seasons, and Dyche in his whole career, he's not the right one to find that balance.

He proved to be Dyche after promising approaches that were visible in autumn 2023, resulting that we have good numbers in chances conceded, but also have the lowest expected goals in the league and not really a satisfying output of results in 2024, and more concerning this season so far.

 

[DualityNSNO]

We've stayed with a clean sheet in 6/9 games since October that's really good, but also stayed without a goal in 6/9 prem games, 4 in a row including games against a very bad in shape West Ham, outnumbered Brentford or winless Southampton.

As you said what showed to be a problem at Everton in the last few seasons, and Dyche in his whole career, he's not the right one to find that balance.

He proved to be Dyche after promising approaches that were visible in autumn 2023, resulting that we have good numbers in chances conceded, but also have the lowest expected goals in the league and not really a satisfying output of results in 2024, and more concerning this season so far.

I mean I don't think he needed to prove he was Dyche, we all should've known Sean Dyche is Sean Dyche

 

[Delargeinho]

I mean I don't think he needed to prove he was Dyche, we all should've known Sean Dyche is Sean Dyche

I do agree, but I still think what has been mentioned here when had a good run of results back then, we played way less hoof and pray for god to score, more direct what to an amount what Nuno or Iraola do, more pressing, more front foot, less passivity....

It's not only the results, but also it was an approach that could have been build up on...

There is a huge difference in numbers this season, especially pressing, where we are far lower than last year.

Something we have seen this season 2-3 times at max. Bmouth, first half Leicester, Ipswich, maybe Wolves or Palace 2nd half, but some of them are optimistic to get mentioned.

 

[Lanolin]

His own expectations as defined by him, despite fluking 12th, are "avoid relegation again" - further proving 12th was a fluke - and that's a problem in itself. He steadied the ship at first, as you say, but then punched holes in the hull himself, so now it just fills with water slower than before.

These players played *okay* football for Lampard and looked competent, but lacking solidity at the back - Dyche came in and fixed that but is utter turd at anything else as it was already known from before he even came to us. It's not unreasonable to think that anyone with any kind of managerial nous isn't able to implement at least a solid but direct approach with these players, not just hoof and hope - you know, actual pragmatism, not what Dyche mislabels as pragmatism.

Also Doucoure is likely either back in the water carrier role or benched/out of the team for any other manager.

The revisionism of Lampard's time here is properly odd. We absolutely did not look OK under him, we looked utterly shambolic for long periods. He was sacked after 23 games in all competitions and at that point we'd scored more than once in 2 of them. The unbelievably defensive negative Dyche then proceeded to manage it 4 times in the remaining 18 games and has done it 6 times in 17 games this season. That's not to say Dyche is good, it's just to highlight the complete absurdity of your take on it.

Fluke is obviously an unnecessarily pejorative way to put it, but yes to some extent 12th didn't really accurately show how last season went for us. Quite why it became the minimum expectation for this season despite that fairly obvious fact I don't know, but that's people for you I suppose.

 

[Saint Domingo]

.. and you wonder why so many people take the piss out of you..

From an A1 type crybot

 

[Delargeinho]

The revisionism of Lampard's time here is properly odd. We absolutely did not look OK under him, we looked utterly shambolic for long periods. He was sacked after 23 games in all competitions and at that point we'd scored more than once in 2 of them. The unbelievably defensive negative Dyche then proceeded to manage it 4 times in the remaining 18 games and has done it 6 times in 17 games this season. That's not to say Dyche is good, it's just to highlight the complete absurdity of your take on it.

Fluke is obviously an unnecessarily pejorative way to put it, but yes to some extent 12th didn't really accurately show how last season went for us. Quite why it became the minimum expectation for this season despite that fairly obvious fact I don't know, but that's people for you I suppose.

34 goals in 38 games when Lampard was here in the prem, these are Dyche numbers at Burnley, and 0.92 average a result.

I like Lampard as a person more than Dyche, but that cannot be justified either, despite the way Lampard intended to play is generally better to watch.

 

[Curtis]

It's basically because we don't have any players who can score goals.

It's kinda hard to score goals when our recent attacking strategy is to go on the break and the striker is completely isolated by himself if he gets the ball. It happened to broja twice against Arsenal. Do you think we're bottom in the league for all attacking stats just solely due to the players? Even worse squads have better attacking rates because they're actually setup to create chances

 

[Toffeelover]

What a terrible argument for keeping Dyche.

If we get rid we just might be even worse than we are now

From a pure footballing perspective I'd like to see the end of Dyche now and if Wolves and Southampton get a new manager bounce ( perhaps unlikely) we could be in difficulties if we miss the same boat.

The only argument for retaining Dyche is that we are supremely confident that we will stay up even with him in charge and it's easier to attract a better quality manager and allow them to reorganize in the summer.

Are you sure ?

 

[Delargeinho]

It's kinda hard to score goals when our recent attacking strategy is to go on break and the striker is completely isolated by himself if he gets the ball. It happened to broja twice against Arsenal. Do you think we're bottom in the league for all attacking stats just solely due to the players? Even worse squads have better attacking rates because they're actually setup to create chances

Jep, it was an issue last season when we were mid-table for creating chances, but not this season, where the table pretty much is accurate to what we have showed.

 

[Curtis]

I get there are times you have to adopt a survival mode but when it's your baseline approach it becomes defeatist and actually makes you more susceptible to being beat. We're the only team to lose to Southampton they're woeful. We can't even hold leads look at the bournemouth game. No goals in November and the defensive stats beyond the clean sheets aren't great. Only reason we have the clean sheets is that dyche doesn't even park the bus he camps out with a winnebago all game