New Everton Stadium Discussion

One thing we are forgetting here is that Moshiri HAS got the money to finish the stadium. That is a stone cold sober fact. People quoting what happened to Valencia have to understand that a financial collapse of the Spanish economy during the start of a world recession did for that stadium. I understand that doesn't mean that it WILL get finished. Only Moshiri can answer that question.
Exactly
You have to ask what good is a part built stadium to Moshiri .
That would be a huge waste of time & more importantly money to him.

This isnt the club funding it with a series of loans that need paying. It basically is HIS stadium , he's funding it.

He will only do what is right for him if he stays or goes
 
I get that, but my point is that fans seem to believe the new stadium will happen without issue just because it's better than accepting it won't. There are major concerns over the stadium getting finished, especially with our current plight. Why is nobody challenging the club/owner on who is funding the build or why it's suddenly gone from a guaranteed 500m to 750m? This could all blow up on our faces and be another nail in the coffin. I'm staggered that our fans are just going along with it.
My issue is some people are generally very negative and think the worst case scenario is the most likely scenario, even if that worst case scenario is something that was completely made up on here by other very negative people.
 
One thing we are forgetting here is that Moshiri HAS got the money to finish the stadium. That is a stone cold sober fact. People quoting what happened to Valencia have to understand that a financial collapse of the Spanish economy during the start of a world recession did for that stadium. I understand that doesn't mean that it WILL get finished. Only Moshiri can answer that question.

It is very likely (not a stone cold sober fact) that he (or his backer) has got the readies to complete the stadium. The issue has always been what the ultimate debt will be to the club or any potential new owner, going forward. The original plan was for a 60k+ stadium substantially funded by a commonwealth games. When the bid failed, that had to be revised to a 52k+ stadium, which was supposed to be funded by the owner plus by a loan secured by the club. With Uncle Ussy providing a lucrative sponsorship deal to cover all those on-going costs. That loan package has still not been secured and the Russian has been sanctioned. The financial plan was sketchy at £500m.... but we all turned a blind eye because bank of daddy ruled, and all expenses were covered. At £760m, with no bottomless pit sponsor and potential relegation, that financial plan looks at least as precarious as Valencia's. Hence the inability to secure an attractive loan deal and the on-going search for new investors.... and possibly the reason for our inability to secure any urgently needed new players, despite selling £100m+ worth in the past 6 months. We've had their scatter gun economics on the pitch that has left us completely hamstrung. Have they been equally and as dangerously frivolous with the stadium financial plan?
 

Or moshiri sits on prime land in the middle of the proposed Liverpool waters redevelopment and forces the council to get involved. The insinuation that he will complete the stadium build just because he needs to is absurd.
He can't just sit on the land.

The contract between Everton and Peel will be pretty much watertight in Peels favour.

Remember, it's not Moshiris/Evertons land. We're renting the land we're building a stadium on. We're ONLY allowed to build a stadium there. If we don't build a stadium there we have to dismantle it, return the site to "as was" and hand it back.
 
Many people appear to not understand the stadium is not going to be, and never was going to be Everton Football Clubs stadium. The stadium is to be privately and separately owned by an operating company, Everton will lease the stadium from this company just as Coventry and others do. Everton will fund the repayments of the finance on the stadium on behalf of the owner of club, who as the owner is entitled to take funds from his club/business as he sees fit to do so.

COYB!

John.
 
Or moshiri sits on prime land in the middle of the proposed Liverpool waters redevelopment and forces the council to get involved. The insinuation that he will complete the stadium build just because he needs to is absurd.
Is this the 'Prime land' that sits at the northern extremity of a major landbank that hasn't been developed in two decades despite all the amazing plans for it to happen.

'Prime land' next to a sewage treatment works that is far less prime than the remaining Liverpool Waters land bank for residential or commercial development and would be at the bottom of any list prioritising development of the area.

'Prime land' that only got planning permission to fill in a protected dock and develop for the public good - as a community asset for the city.

Prime land that would be completely unfeasible for anyone to consider writing off the cost to date, demolishing, redesigning, and developing give the likely cost to develop on this site, the lack of appetite for expensive apartments in this area, and economic projections.

Anyone who believes that Moshiri/Usmanov have had their sights set on making a fortune from developing property around the stadium just doesn't understand the real estate market. If it was so lucrative, LW would have developed this area a long time ago.
 
If there’s one thing that they won’t mess up, it’s this stadium. Moshiri needs it completed. In the likely event we go down, he’ll sell the likes of Onana, Pickford and DCL to finance it. Interesting that not a penny of the Gordon money has been spent too.

Feels a bit like a millstone however, as we need it completed before he’ll sell. Hopefully doesn’t stop him completely gutting the boardroom in the interim.
 

The financial plan was sketchy at £500m.... but we all turned a blind eye because bank of daddy ruled, and all expenses were covered. At £760m, with no bottomless pit sponsor and potential relegation, that financial plan looks at least as precarious as Valencia's. Hence the inability to secure an attractive loan deal and the on-going search for new investors.... and possibly the reason for our inability to secure any urgently needed new players, despite selling £100m+ worth in the past 6 months. We've had their scatter gun economics on the pitch that has left us completely hamstrung. Have they been equally and as dangerously frivolous with the stadium financial plan?

I increasingly view this whole Moshiri ownership/stadium debacle and our collective reaction to it as the first stage of grief for the loss of what this club once was. We'd just reached a point of desperation where dissenting voices barely registered. The kool-aid of a fools hope was just too alluring after 20 years of slow bleeding.

Denial.

How else can the massed ranks of blues with fingers in their ears, gleefully humming Z cars be explained?

How does a new £500m stadium, next to a sewage works, with just 52,000 seats pay for itself with a northern fan base? (Hush now, it's on the banks of the royal blue Mersey, we'll be financially and culturally dominant in no time! Kopites are bricking it. Banks will fall over themselves trying to get involved)

What sort of basket case club generates losses on this scale or runs with a wages v turnover ratio of this size? (Relax, it's all part of Uncle Uzi's grand plan. We'll be on par with the big 6 soon enough. Moshiri is a billionaire accountant, they never lose money really)

Won't Brexit, COVID and inflation impact on stadium build costs? Finances would be really sketchy then. ( Uncle Uzi has it all in hand. Owns a steel mill don't you know. Mosh is still an accountant, er.... Oh and good old Denise has negotiated the bestest fixed price deal known to man. Pah and to think some of you doubted the wisdom of appointing a small-time charity chief executive to run a club embarking on one of the biggest infrastructure projects in the world).

Hmmm. This Ukraine business doesn't look promising for us. How the hell do we stay viable without Usmanov and his oceans of cash in the background? Won't Mosh be impacted? (You just don't get billionaires. They can work around anything governments put in their way. Anyway, Uncle Uzi isn't that close to Putin, so won't be affected..... Crap. Never mind, Mosh is an independently wealthy. Billionaire accountant don't you know. Barely any links to Usmanov really. All is well. Chill)

What sort of billionaire can't source loans to help finish a hugely viable new build stadium? Come to think of it, what sort of billionaire announces a stadium funding gap and the says 'I could of course cover this myself.....however....'? (Are you seriously suggesting our independently wealthy billionaire accountant who never loses money and definitely hasn't in any way been impacted by sanctions couldn't magic up another £400 odd million to fund a stadium that is definitely going to pay for itself? Anyway, there are wealthy people all over the place just desperate to by a minority stake in us at this juncture to help fund this definitely viable stadium)

Isn't it frustrating that other clubs have gone about increasing capacity and income generating potential so substantially at their hemmed in and dilapidated old stadiums at a fraction of the cost we're now bearing? If only the club hadn't falsely ruled out that option 15 years ago and then spent the intervening years refusing to acknowledge their error. ( What other clubs, including one roughly a mile away, have done has no bearing on what would have been possible for us. We had no option. Bill said so. So did good old honest Joe on the council. Anyway, are you really questioning the logic of our completely viable new build on the royal blue Mersey?)


It's noticeable that, somewhat belatedly, the humming seems to be dipping in volume.

The time for anger is fast approaching
 
I increasingly view this whole Moshiri ownership/stadium debacle and our collective reaction to it as the first stage of grief for the loss of what this club once was. We'd just reached a point of desperation where dissenting voices barely registered. The kool-aid of a fools hope was just too alluring after 20 years of slow bleeding.

Denial.

How else can the massed ranks of blues with fingers in their ears, gleefully humming Z cars be explained?

How does a new £500m stadium, next to a sewage works, with just 52,000 seats pay for itself with a northern fan base? (Hush now, it's on the banks of the royal blue Mersey, we'll be financially and culturally dominant in no time! Kopites are bricking it. Banks will fall over themselves trying to get involved)

What sort of basket case club generates losses on this scale or runs with a wages v turnover ratio of this size? (Relax, it's all part of Uncle Uzi's grand plan. We'll be on par with the big 6 soon enough. Moshiri is a billionaire accountant, they never lose money really)

Won't Brexit, COVID and inflation impact on stadium build costs? Finances would be really sketchy then. ( Uncle Uzi has it all in hand. Owns a steel mill don't you know. Mosh is still an accountant, er.... Oh and good old Denise has negotiated the bestest fixed price deal known to man. Pah and to think some of you doubted the wisdom of appointing a small-time charity chief executive to run a club embarking on one of the biggest infrastructure projects in the world).

Hmmm. This Ukraine business doesn't look promising for us. How the hell do we stay viable without Usmanov and his oceans of cash in the background? Won't Mosh be impacted? (You just don't get billionaires. They can work around anything governments put in their way. Anyway, Uncle Uzi isn't that close to Putin, so won't be affected..... Crap. Never mind, Mosh is an independently wealthy. Billionaire accountant don't you know. Barely any links to Usmanov really. All is well. Chill)

What sort of billionaire can't source loans to help finish a hugely viable new build stadium? Come to think of it, what sort of billionaire announces a stadium funding gap and the says 'I could of course cover this myself.....however....'? (Are you seriously suggesting our independently wealthy billionaire accountant who never loses money and definitely hasn't in any way been impacted by sanctions couldn't magic up another £400 odd million to fund a stadium that is definitely going to pay for itself? Anyway, there are wealthy people all over the place just desperate to by a minority stake in us at this juncture to help fund this definitely viable stadium)

Isn't it frustrating that other clubs have gone about increasing capacity and income generating potential so substantially at their hemmed in and dilapidated old stadiums at a fraction of the cost we're now bearing? If only the club hadn't falsely ruled out that option 15 years ago and then spent the intervening years refusing to acknowledge their error. ( What other clubs, including one roughly a mile away, have done has no bearing on what would have been possible for us. We had no option. Bill said so. So did good old honest Joe on the council. Anyway, are you really questioning the logic of our completely viable new build on the royal blue Mersey?)


It's noticeable that, somewhat belatedly, the humming seems to be dipping in volume.

The time for anger is fast approaching
That's a lot of words to say "I am a miserable git that exaggerates a lot"
 
I wonder if we will have an announcement about the 'investment' in the club to finance the stadium this week. If this 'investment' actually exists, I feel that the club will announce it before the Arsenal game, to deflect from the absolutely abysmal showing in the transfer window. If we do not hear anything before Arsenal, I will begin to have serious doubts about the existence of this investment.
 
I get that, but my point is that fans seem to believe the new stadium will happen without issue just because it's better than accepting it won't. There are major concerns over the stadium getting finished, especially with our current plight. Why is nobody challenging the club/owner on who is funding the build or why it's suddenly gone from a guaranteed 500m to 750m? This could all blow up on our faces and be another nail in the coffin. I'm staggered that our fans are just going along with it.

Those who are close to the build don't have those concerns. The concern isn't whether it gets built, the concern is what happens once it is.

The guarantee was a £500m construction phase. The entirety of the process is much more than that.
 
A couple of points I'd love to know the answers but have not fact checked.

Who actually owns Goodison park? And will the assets from the sale of it go towards BMD?

Somebody mentioned above BMD will NEVER be owned by Everton, surely the owner or buyer of Everton is Everton.

How does the ownership of the new ground become the property of a 3rd party?

Apologies for the numpty questions.
 

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