Roberto Martinez Discussion - Including Live Poll (Poll Reset 1st May)

[billycopper]

please read the Moshiri thread. Even the last 5 pages will answer your questions.

The Everton board are secretive at the best of times and even if they did explain it to us, I'm sure that high-end business and finance is very confusing. We can only ever make guesses based on a little bit of knowledge which may or may not be factually accurate.

 

[JLW]

If we'd drawn 0-0 or 1-1 yesterday all the pressure would have been on Van Gaal and we'd be talking about a decent draw to a team who have recently beaten City and Arsenal and only conceded one league goal since the start of March.

Yes, there are problems but Baines hasn't said that we have "no chemistry". He has said that "the chemistry isn't quite there at the moment". It's a major difference.

Our confidence is low and getting on their back isn't going to help. We need to stick together. If the team are afraid of making mistakes our football will become increasingly sterile and predictable and we'll still make mistakes anyway.

Yesterday Blind and Smalling were able to double up on Lukaku and he was receiving high balls with his back to goal. Even Ibrahimovich would have struggled to create anything for himself. I'd have liked to have seen us switch to 4-4-2, so that Rom could have isolated one of their centrebacks.

Our wingers were ahead of the ball when play broke down and McCarthy and Cleverley were overwhelmed. If we'd been a bit more compact in the middle it might have helped us to keep the ball better.

Baines and Coleman offered nothing going forward because they were afraid of leaving space in behind them. Our back four was still too stretched though and it was easy to play through us. If we had two banks of four spanning the width of the penalty area they wouldn't have broken us down and we had enough pace on the counter to trouble them.

I think that the team are disappointed that things seem to be going against them and they've become a bit despondent. It happens. It might be the catalyst for Martinez to change system and suddenly things will click into place. Perhaps we need to go to 4-3-3 with a Dogs of War trio of Besic, Barry and McCarthy in the middle and move Barkley out to the left? That might give us enough protection for the fullbacks to start bombing on again.

Until yesterday we'd lost the same number of games as City, Chelsea and Liverpool and only one more than United. We've still only conceded one more goal than Liverpool and Chelsea. And only the top four clubs have outscored us.

It's those fine margins that are costing us once again.

You can come up with all the stats you want the end of the day we are going backwards under Martinez FACT!!! The only fine margin that's stopping us progressing is the one that stands outside the dugout with his arms folded!!! He has no plan B, his subs are poor at best, how many gritty performances have we had? how many draws or wins from losing positions have we had? How many points have we dropped from winning positions,, (lets not go there eh!!!) So you want to play 3 defensive midfielders to sure up the defense most teams play with one and have a great defense, its down to the organization that comes from the manger

Moyes wouldn't be in the frame now we have more money. The problem is when you think through the managers most are unpopular due to i) emotional reasons ie manager a rival team or ii) were seen as having failed at other clubs for not meeting unrealistic expectations

I expect none of Brendan Rogers, LVG or Pelligrini for example would be popular choices

You're then left with obscure foreign managers who have not yet managed here and tarnished their reputations or formed associations with rivals

Now that the rent boys have announced their new manger Conte we should be trying to get Gus Hiddink he would be the perfect choice!! Premier league experience, respected and known in world football, attract decent players and money to spend, also still unbeaten in the league since he took over.....

 

[The Esk]

Nothing wrong with that. The agreements at Everton won't be public knowledge. Officially the club acknowledged that Moshiri had bought a 49.9% stake but they didn't divulge any more than that. We can't know any contractual details or any verbal agreements between the parties.

Well we now know (in the public domain) there's an agreement for Moshiri to acquire Bill's shares (4,256) Jon Woods shares (3,166) and Abercromby's shares (1,935) which would give him 26,822 shares (76.6%) and effective control of Everton.

Above the 75% threshold he's in total control even though he does not own all the club.

 

[Elong]

I haven't put anyone down. The Moshiri thread is conjecture. I'm sure that he does have every intention to buy the club outright but there will only be a handful of people who know what's actually going on and they're hardly likely to tell the rest of the world unless it suits them.

I didn't say you did. I'm just telling you that you're wrong. As quoted above.

 

[deipnosophist]

From what we've heard Roberto's vision for the team, once the old guard hang up their boots is something like this:

Joel
Coleman Stones Funes Mori Galloway
Besic McCarthy
Deulofeu Barkley Yarmolenko
Lukaku
​

We'll also probably see players like McAleny and Dowell breaking through. Michael Ball was right when he said Everton are playing Academy football because ordinarily at least half the team would still be learning their trade in the junior ranks. We've got some exceptional players who are having to grow up quickly.

I'm looking forward to seeing partnerships develop all over the pitch and for this young side to hit their peak together. Yarmolenko has, apparently, said that he'd rather play every week for us rather than sit on the bench at Barca. Surely the same thought will come into Lukaku's reckoning.

I don't buy it that Roberto has lost the dressing room. The players say how thorough he is and how much they've learned from him. I'm sure that they enjoy training sessions and McCarthy has called him a "tactical genius". It's obvious that they like him on a personal level too. I think that they're disappointed in themselves and frustrated that things aren't going their way.

It's fantastic how much Roberto has bought into the club and how he makes sure that the players know what a privilege it is to play for Everton. It's great that he watches all the youth team games and he isn't afraid to give younger players a chance. I love that he encourages them to express themselves, to enjoy their football and take chances. I'm so pleased that he tries to play attacking, entertaining football too.

It would be very difficult to find somebody to carry on that project AND to achieve results in the short term too. Besides Wenger I can't think of another current manager who has such a vision for their club.

If we can keep our star players in the summer and give him the money to build the side that he wants and we're still in mid-table then fair enough. But what have we lost by seeing things through as they are? We're not going to get relegated and we've no hope of Champions League football. The FA Cup is a lottery. Hopefully the players will feel like they owe it to Roberto to go out and win it.

Nice one

 

[Blue Cheese]

"and now, the end is near, and so I face the final curtain...I did it MY WAY" Bobby's anthem.

 

[big bobs beard]

Just a thought but when Sunderland Newcastle and Villa go down, who are we going to beat?? That is going to put us down as one of the favourites to go down. Players this summer will look at us and prefer to sign for West Ham, Southampton, Leicester Stoke etc. As much as I have wanted Bobby to succeed it's not going to happen. Has taken the gloss of Wembley a bit hasn't it? I can't remember any club getting to a cup semi with fans desperate for the manager to be fired

 

[The Penalty Box Dancer]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...staff-left-club-turned-sour-Everton-boss.html

This article that was written last year makes sense. Influential figures at the club left and martinez became soft. No discipline and it even says fitness was a problem. You only have to look on the field now to see that it is.

 

[Jimmy1]

Just a thought but when Sunderland Newcastle and Villa go down, who are we going to beat?? That is going to put us down as one of the favourites to go down. Players this summer will look at us and prefer to sign for West Ham, Southampton, Leicester Stoke etc. As much as I have wanted Bobby to succeed it's not going to happen. Has taken the gloss of Wembley a bit hasn't it? I can't remember any club getting to a cup semi with fans desperate for the manager to be fired

Its alright though mate because according to some we will just get Mourinho in and sign Yarmelenko and a few other boss players and we'll be class.

Meanwhile back on planet earth.

 

[bcblue1878]

Why would Bill trust his club to a foreign manager that he has no relationship with when one of his close friends, who knows the club inside out is available? He'll argue that Davey is a better manager for his time at United and Sociedad and that we can now give him the funds that were denied him in his first spell.

Not sure if you've spotted it but it ain't Bill's any more! He may well still be Chairman largely in name only, but he no longer makes the decisions and definitely doesn't sign the cheques!

 

[toffee matt]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/fo...staff-left-club-turned-sour-Everton-boss.html

This article that was written last year makes sense. Influential figures at the club left and martinez became soft. No discipline and it even says fitness was a problem. You only have to look on the field now to see that it is.

Nothing's changed in a year ultimately.

Still losing games
Still conceding goals
Still not winning at Home
Still looking tactically clueless
Still looks like the players don't listen/understand him.

A few decent results at the end of last season and the start of this one have saved Martinez' bacon.

 

[CahillsCornerFlag]

Richard Keys in on the act, and he's spot on.

"I sense there's some big decisions to be made at Everton pretty soon,” he said. “What a wasted season. Roberto Martinez has assembled their best Premier League squad ever, but he seems incapable of getting a performance out of them. They were poor at United. I know there's another cup semi-final to come but 12th? Not good enough."

“I'll tell you now, the squad won't be this good next season. I don't care about all the tough talk, if Lukaku wants to leave - and he does - then he will."


We're languishing in 12th WITH Lukaku's goals, and people have rightly pointed out that when 3 of the worst prem sides I've ever seen in Villa, Newcastle and Sunderland go down, who are we going to beat? We've not shown we can beat the newly promoted teams in the league so far.

I'm going to be genuinely worried if we don't sack this guy right after the season finishes, it's really not hard to see us getting dragged into a relegation battle the next couple of years if our best players all start to leave, which they all will, turning us basically into Wigan.

 

[eddy]

I fear next season if Martinez remains in charge. Lukaku is as good as gone, Barklay may leave also. Who could we attract now that most clubs
have a similar budget to recruit players? I thought Moshiri would of acted by now and canned Martinez. Doing this I think is a statement of intent, not doing so concerns me, as am I right in thinking any player sales Moshiri would recieve 49.9% of the uplift? just a thought really. Moshiri needs to stamp his authority on this now and relieve Martinez of his position

 

[Ashtonian]

Just a thought but when Sunderland Newcastle and Villa go down, who are we going to beat?? That is going to put us down as one of the favourites to go down. Players this summer will look at us and prefer to sign for West Ham, Southampton, Leicester Stoke etc. As much as I have wanted Bobby to succeed it's not going to happen. Has taken the gloss of Wembley a bit hasn't it? I can't remember any club getting to a cup semi with fans desperate for the manager to be fired

Richard Keys in on the act, and he's spot on.

"I sense there's some big decisions to be made at Everton pretty soon,” he said. “What a wasted season. Roberto Martinez has assembled their best Premier League squad ever, but he seems incapable of getting a performance out of them. They were poor at United. I know there's another cup semi-final to come but 12th? Not good enough."

“I'll tell you now, the squad won't be this good next season. I don't care about all the tough talk, if Lukaku wants to leave - and he does - then he will."


We're languishing in 12th WITH Lukaku's goals, and people have rightly pointed out that when 3 of the worst prem sides I've ever seen in Villa, Newcastle and Sunderland go down, who are we going to beat? We've not shown we can beat the newly promoted teams in the league so far.

I'm going to be genuinely worried if we don't sack this guy right after the season finishes, it's really not hard to see us getting dragged into a relegation battle the next couple of years if our best players all start to leave, which they all will, turning us basically into Wigan.

A point I have been making a long time. Go back a year and we were 14th at one point. Who was below us? Three of them were the current bottom three. They have propped us up and made the season look less awful to some people. Go back 12 months and I was getting vaulted because we best qpr and Newcastle. Take those three out the equation and lukakus goals, you get a more realistic picture of how terrible we really are.

 

[willo30]

I hope that we can give Roberto the same sort of time to build his empire and bring through some of our promising, young players.

You don't get the time nowadays. Players don't want to wait. See Lukaku and Stones. It's a short career for some.
If you want to instill a new style then do it with the youth up to the under 21's. Doing it with the 1st team is not working, which is even worse when there wasn't much wrong with it when he took over.
The board can give him all the time he needs but he's flogging a dead horse when players are looking to jump ship each year.
If we are not careful we are just going to be a feeder club for the top teams soon. I know players have moved on in the past but not players of the calibre we are attracting now.