No Dosh, time for a reboot?

[Sylvain]

It's pretty clear that this summer isn't going to be any different from the last three with regards to money for transfers.

But I can't help but feel that we desperatley need fresh blood, 1. Becausce this team needs a fit quality striker 2. Physiologically I think the players need to see additions to see the club has geniune ambitions to be in the top 6

We sold Mcfadden and Johnson and made a big signing in Fellaini (as well as getting Saha as replacement for Andy), and as much as I liked those two lads that was probaly one of the best peices of business Moyes has done. It was a frustrating summer but the signing of Fellaini was a massive boost of quality to team and also it seemed to give us a good feeling about the future.

In 2009 we sold Lesscott, and the whole saga was messy and disruptive but had we just accpted the envetible and got johnny, dustbin and billy in early that could have been a really good season (just look at form post december), the team was certainly better for those three additions.

I think we also all concour that in ideal world we'd want to keep this whole squad together and add it to it. In comparison to players who have been sold in the past to fund other signings Beattie, Mcfadden, Johnson etc. there are no real expendble players in this current squad (bar the Yak and Yobo, but how much will they raise?)

So I know I'm commiting treason here and I love the lad to bits but why not try and get some big cash for Rodwell? Get in 1, 2 or maybe 3 great players to refresh and boost the squad. I know the longer we keep him here the more he'll develop and therefore the more we get from Utd, Chelsea or Citeh.

But think about it, if we hang on to Rodwell 'till say 2013, whithout further external investment, where are we going to be as club? I'd say we'd continue this backward decline and we may be in similar position to where we were when we sold Rooney and the rodders money we'll be used to pay of our debt (as the money for finishing 5th or 6th in the league won't be in our bank, we'll be having the scraps that are dished out by the Premier League to the bottom 8 or 9 teams). Even if the the debt isn't a issue, will we still be attractive to players who are of similar calibre to the Mout, huntelaar, van de vaart etc. when we're finishing 13th, 14th.

Also take into considoration the likes saha, cahill, distin and Neville are in there 30s. I know it's difficult to take but the general feeling is we just can't go on like this. The more we dither and cross our fingers that money will come, treading water, the more we'll have seasons like these last two.

We need some sort of action plan, that would be mine if I was general manager, I hope Moyesie has something up his sleeve becausce something needs to change.

 

[blueblue]

Whereas I agree that sometimes you may have to sell a player to raise cash so that you can reinvest in other areas the fact remains that Evertonians vastly over estimate the amount you would receive for Jack Rodwell if he were sold.
Strikers make big money,other players not so much.
In time Jack Rodwell will be a fine player but at present he is a squad member,is not certain of his place and there are probably eight other players that are more important to the team than he is.We simply will not get the kind of fee that people talk about.
Rodwell has to be kept and developed to realise his full potential....or maybe his full value.

 

[CahillsCornerFlag]

If, and it's a big if, we received an offer of £25-£30mil for Rodwell I would take it. Some may call it negative, but I agree that it's necessary as let's face it, our centre of midfield is very strong anyway (he's not better than arteta and fellaini). However we would need to tie fellaini down to a long term deal before selling Rodwell, as otherwise we might have to flog fellaini to the highest bidder in the summer.

 

[Toffees_USA]

i can see both arguments, and I'm really not sure what we should do. I love rodders, think he has huge potential. but i just have to trust moyes. he'll either bring in fresh blood or develop our youngsters, and whichever he chooses is the right move. Both are risky, though.

 

[davek]

So, what you're advocating isn't a departure from the strategy that's brought us to our knees in the first place, you're just asking for more of the same?

We are where we are because we've sold nearly our assets to tread water: property, future season ticket money, outsourcing of services/merchandise, and sale of talent. But you see selling more assets as the solution?

I'd say we need another strategy to the busted one. Maybe the board of directors will come out of their cave to tell us what the alternative to this failed strategy is.

 

[TheFinnFan]

time to...support the team

 

[ijjysmith]

I'm tempted to agree with the point on the original post.

I'm yet to be 100% convinced by Rodwell (I know in the minority here), but he just hasn't had the wow factor for me...yet.

I too would be tempted to sell him for the greater good. Dead right, the squad needs freshening up.

If one of Rodwell or Fellaini has to go in order to get a good amount of money then it's a pretty easy choice for me.

However, I would add we should never ever have to be in a position to sell to buy...but we know that's where we are.

 

[Sheedy's Third]

Whereas I agree that sometimes you may have to sell a player to raise cash so that you can reinvest in other areas the fact remains that Evertonians vastly over estimate the amount you would receive for Jack Rodwell if he were sold.
Strikers make big money,other players not so much.
In time Jack Rodwell will be a fine player but at present he is a squad member,is not certain of his place and there are probably eight other players that are more important to the team than he is.We simply will not get the kind of fee that people talk about.
Rodwell has to be kept and developed to realise his full potential....or maybe his full value.

Unless we do a Lescott and sell him to Man City.

 

[bluefitzy]

Have to say i dont agree with you about selling Rodders,but i see were your coming from:we need players.I do think he is worth 20 mil but has anyone bid for him? I dont know(ask l.c.a.b.).I think any half decent english player is going to sell for 15mil upwards so we would get a decent price for him but we need to build around the likes of him and Felli.Again its down to lack of investment why we cant.These are worrying times.

 

[Sylvain]

So, what you're advocating isn't a departure from the strategy that's brought us to our knees in the first place, you're just asking for more of the same?

We are where we are because we've sold nearly our assets to tread water: property, future season ticket money, outsourcing of services/merchandise, and sale of talent. But you see selling more assets as the solution?

I'd say we need another strategy to the busted one. Maybe the board of directors will come out of their cave to tell us what the alternative to this failed strategy is.

But nobody's going to invest, either we sell a player for an inflated fee (like the lesscott deal) and buy a couple of players or we
have the same thing thats happened this season, stagnation on he pitch. I'm asking for a departure from summer 2010 strategy of: keep all of our best players even though Pienaar plans to leave on a free in 12 months and we need a striker but the manager doesn't like the Yak.

I'm not saying sell for the sake of it, I'm saying sell to improve the team. I cite the Fellaini signing as evidence that Moyes can do it effectivley. If it was anybody else was in charge I would not approve of selling our assets but Moyes has proven it can work.

I agree the long term future doesn't look particuarly bright and structuraly the club is in a real mess off the pitch, but in the short term and on the pitch I'd rather see the team get somewhere close to where we were two or three years ago. I mean the club had all the same long term concerns in 07/08/09 but nobody was quite so concerned becausce we were doing well on the pitch. Taking a risk and selling an asset to buy one or two good players won't save the club of the pitch (and it won't make it any worse either) but could improve the performances/results on the pitch, which is start.

You never know the clubs finances might not even be that bad and the club may be sustainble.

I'm just throwing this out there to GOT, after all DM's the manager and buying/selling players is his remit. But seriously our stagnation on the pitch, is starting to reflect our stagnation off the pitch. We need to arrest the slide somehow because no money is coming in that will just magicaly solve all our problems.

P.S. Never sell Fellaini, he's the calibre of player I want us to sign if we sell another player. I'm more inclined to shift Jagielka (what with us having Heit, Duffy, Distin and Rodwell capable of playing there.) It's horrible though loosing any of our players.

 

[davek]

But nobody's going to invest, either we sell a player for an inflated fee (like the lesscott deal) and buy a couple of players or we
have the same thing thats happened the season. I'm asking for a departure from summer 2010 strategy of: keep all of our best players even though Pienaar plans to leave on a free in 12 months and we need a striker but the manager doesn't like the Yak.

I agree the long term future doesn't look particuarly bright and structuraly the club is in a real mess off the pitch, but in the short term and on the pitch I'd rather see the team get somewhere close to where were two or three years ago. I mean the club had all the same long term concerns in 07/08/09 but nobody was quite so concerned becausce we were doing well on the pitch. Taking a risk and selling an asset to buy one or two good players won't save the club of the pitch (and it won't make it any worse either) but could improve the performances/results on the pitch, which is start.

You never know the clubs finances might not even be that bad and the club may be sustainble.

P.S. Never sell Fellaini, he's the calibre of player I want us to sign if we sell another player. I'm more inclined to shift Jagielka (what with us having Heit, Duffy, Distin and Rodwell capable of playing there.) It's horrible though loosing any of our players.

It's a hit and hope strategy to get back to 6th in the league: sell a player and get two in and hope that provides the catalyst for improved results and more prize money/gate money. Three years ago that wasn't good enough as an achievement for a club like us, it isn't any more acceptable now.

Let's face it, we're scrambling around here in the gutter. Trying to sell that as a forward move is not on. We need root and branch change, not more of the same old rubbish that got us here.

 

[ijjysmith]

Have to say i dont agree with you about selling Rodders,but i see were your coming from:we need players.I do think he is worth 20 mil but has anyone bid for him? I dont know(ask l.c.a.b.).I think any half decent english player is going to sell for 15mil upwards so we would get a decent price for him but we need to build around the likes of him and Felli.Again its down to lack of investment why we cant.These are worrying times.

Interesting.

If Carroll is worth £30 odd million, then just how much is Rodwell worth?

 

[Sylvain]

It's a hit and hope strategy to get back to 6th in the league: sell a player and get two in and hope that provides the catalyst for improved results and more prize money/gate money. Three years ago that wasn't good enough as an achievement for a club like us, it isn't any more acceptable now.

Let's face it, we're scrambling around here in the gutter. Trying to sell that as a forward move is not on. We need root and branch change, not more of the same old rubbish that got us here.

I can understand everything you say. But what are current board going to do? If we do finish sixth next season or even this, you're right to say it's not massive achievement in the context of this club's history but it'll be enough to keep Moyes happy, as opposed to the frustrated figure he is at the moment. I don't expect The gate/prize money of 6th to swell the transfer budget at all, the gate/prize money of 6th seems to be miumium expected to keep the club sustainble, which is very worrying.

 

[billycopper]

It's pretty clear that this summer isn't going to be any different from the last three with regards to money for transfers.

But I can't help but feel that we desperatley need fresh blood, 1. Becausce this team needs a fit quality striker 2. Physiologically I think the players need to see additions to see the club has geniune ambitions to be in the top 6

We sold Mcfadden and Johnson and made a big signing in Fellaini (as well as getting Saha as replacement for Andy), and as much as I liked those two lads that was probaly one of the best peices of business Moyes has done. It was a frustrating summer but the signing of Fellaini was a massive boost of quality to team and also it seemed to give us a good feeling about the future.

In 2009 we sold Lesscott, and the whole saga was messy and disruptive but had we just accpted the envetible and got johnny, dustbin and billy in early that could have been a really good season (just look at form post december), the team was certainly better for those three additions.

I think we also all concour that in ideal world we'd want to keep this whole squad together and add it to it. In comparison to players who have been sold in the past to fund other signings Beattie, Mcfadden, Johnson etc. there are no real expendble players in this current squad (bar the Yak and Yobo, but how much will they raise?)

So I know I'm commiting treason here and I love the lad to bits but why not try and get some big cash for Rodwell? Get in 1, 2 or maybe 3 great players to refresh and boost the squad. I know the longer we keep him here the more he'll develop and therefore the more we get from Utd, Chelsea or Citeh.

But think about it, if we hang on to Rodwell 'till say 2013, whithout further external investment, where are we going to be as club? I'd say we'd continue this backward decline and we may be in similar position to where we were when we sold Rooney and the rodders money we'll be used to pay of our debt (as the money for finishing 5th or 6th in the league won't be in our bank, we'll be having the scraps that are dished out by the Premier League to the bottom 8 or 9 teams). Even if the the debt isn't a issue, will we still be attractive to players who are of similar calibre to the Mout, huntelaar, van de vaart etc. when we're finishing 13th, 14th.

Also take into considoration the likes saha, cahill, distin and Neville are in there 30s. I know it's difficult to take but the general feeling is we just can't go on like this. The more we dither and cross our fingers that money will come, treading water, the more we'll have seasons like these last two.

We need some sort of action plan, that would be mine if I was general manager, I hope Moyesie has something up his sleeve becausce something needs to change.

You make some good points. The squad certainly needs freshening up and we could probably do with adding as many as half a dozen new faces. Reportedly the deals for Yobo and Yak would add up to £11m, provided that Leicester are promoted. We don't have too much other dead wood to shift. We might as well sell Mucha. We might get £1.5m for him. Heitinga is a luxury that we can do without. His value might be £8m. Added to the £4m we've clawed in during this window, that would give us close to £25m to spend next summer.

If a ridiculous bid came in for Rodwell we'd probably have to take it, especially as such deals are likely to become a thing of the past and prices will drop sharply before too long.

Moyes has said himself that the age of the squad is creeping up again. I think that next season will be Neville's last and that Saha will become more of a bit part player, if he isn't sold. Gueye and Barkley (once fit) appear to be the closest to making the step up from the reserves. We're going to have to bring in atleast a couple of bosmans or loans in the next window to fill out the squad.

We're never going to attract the likes of Huntelaar, even if we have money and we're competing in the Champions League. We're not a glamour side to world and european footballers and, given the choice, they'd rather go to London.

If, before next season, two of the young lads come through, we make a couple of strong loan/free signings and we bring in a pair of £3-£6m players or someone from the lower leagues and a bigger money signing, we will have done very well.

 

[EFC-Liam]

It's pretty clear that this summer isn't going to be any different from the last three with regards to money for transfers.

But I can't help but feel that we desperatley need fresh blood, 1. Becausce this team needs a fit quality striker 2. Physiologically I think the players need to see additions to see the club has geniune ambitions to be in the top 6

We sold Mcfadden and Johnson and made a big signing in Fellaini (as well as getting Saha as replacement for Andy), and as much as I liked those two lads that was probaly one of the best peices of business Moyes has done. It was a frustrating summer but the signing of Fellaini was a massive boost of quality to team and also it seemed to give us a good feeling about the future.

In 2009 we sold Lesscott, and the whole saga was messy and disruptive but had we just accpted the envetible and got johnny, dustbin and billy in early that could have been a really good season (just look at form post december), the team was certainly better for those three additions.

I think we also all concour that in ideal world we'd want to keep this whole squad together and add it to it. In comparison to players who have been sold in the past to fund other signings Beattie, Mcfadden, Johnson etc. there are no real expendble players in this current squad (bar the Yak and Yobo, but how much will they raise?)

So I know I'm commiting treason here and I love the lad to bits but why not try and get some big cash for Rodwell? Get in 1, 2 or maybe 3 great players to refresh and boost the squad. I know the longer we keep him here the more he'll develop and therefore the more we get from Utd, Chelsea or Citeh.

But think about it, if we hang on to Rodwell 'till say 2013, whithout further external investment, where are we going to be as club? I'd say we'd continue this backward decline and we may be in similar position to where we were when we sold Rooney and the rodders money we'll be used to pay of our debt (as the money for finishing 5th or 6th in the league won't be in our bank, we'll be having the scraps that are dished out by the Premier League to the bottom 8 or 9 teams). Even if the the debt isn't a issue, will we still be attractive to players who are of similar calibre to the Mout, huntelaar, van de vaart etc. when we're finishing 13th, 14th.

Also take into considoration the likes saha, cahill, distin and Neville are in there 30s. I know it's difficult to take but the general feeling is we just can't go on like this. The more we dither and cross our fingers that money will come, treading water, the more we'll have seasons like these last two.

We need some sort of action plan, that would be mine if I was general manager, I hope Moyesie has something up his sleeve becausce something needs to change.

Although i agree with alot of what you say, I would be very disappointed if we sold Rodwell...I think a better solution to our lack of finances may be to try and build a team around Fellaini & Rodwell .. (We already have the core of a good young side now with them two, Coleman, Baines, Jags (Young for a CB), Anichebe, Howard (young for GK)... & blood through a few of the youngsters (Duffy, Gueye, Barkley, Garbutt, Bidwell, Dier (might be a clause in the deal that we get to buy, first option etc.), Velios, Abdullayev, Wallace, Baxter, Adam Davies – even as squad players to give the squad dept) & potentially add to this youngsters from the lower leagues showing potential (i.e. Jennings - Tranmere) & we could to start to build a promising side that with the addition of a decent signing or two could potentially challenge at the top end of the table and be the core of our side for years to come!