Do we bottle the big games ?

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tadpole

Player Valuation: £15m
Twelve months ago we were bemoaning the fact that after knocking Chelsea out of the cup we'd gone and lost to Reading. What did people say then ? "That's the Everton way" - implying that it's the easier games that are the problem for us, not the bigger games.

Look, it's the nature of a cup competition that each game is a little bit bigger than the last. So the game where you get knocked out is always going to be in an important sense the "biggest" game. Even leaving that aside, if you look back over the last 20 years, we've been in three FA Cup semis and two finals. We were very much the underdogs in 4 of those games, the last one the chances were more even. We got three wins and two defeats. Not bad for a team that "bottles" the big games.

Does our record against Liverpool prove otherwise ? 2012, like 1986, will go down as a massive opportunity missed : an occasion when we were good enough to win, were in front, and blew it. But remember this : Liverpool had never played at the new Wembley before this month. We had. And we earned that right by knocking - guess who - Liverpool out of the cup in 2009.

When teams do bottle big games the causes are psychological : fear, and lack of belief. Maybe Liverpool just had more belief than us on the day. But I just don't see that we need to build this up into some big problem. The squad have shown that they have the strength and the belief to take on the big guns and to win a good percentage of the time. Whether we'll win any trophies under Moyes who knows, but don't rule it out just yet.
 
short answer: yes

the last time we demonstrated we could get the important results when under pressure was during that amazing run of 1-0's in the 04/05 season (our Mitchell brothers to the fore).

We need a hard [Poor language removed] in midfield again.
 
Short answer YES, Correct answer (for me) NO

Was Sunderland in the 1/4 final not a big game ?
City at Home, United away.

If Distin clears that ball into touch in the semi finals we probably dont have this discussion, the fact is we just didnt play well enough second half in the semi final.

The league derby game well David Moyes was totally to blame for his team selection.
 
Big games

We've had three major chances to get silverware in the last 10 seasons: LC SF, FA Cup SF, FA Cup Final...we were atrocious in all but the first leg of the LC SF.

Our record in Derby games in the same period is a disgrace; an utter disgrace that should shame the manager and playing staff.

Under no circumstances could I see that changing under the present set up. To change matters you need a bold and creative decision maker. We have Moyes.
 

Big games

We've had three major chances to get silverware in the last 10 seasons: LC SF, FA Cup SF, FA Cup Final...we were atrocious in all but the first leg of the LC SF.

Our record in Derby games in the same period is a disgrace; an utter disgrace that should shame the manager and playing staff.

Under no circumstances could I see that changing under the present set up. To change matters you need a bold and creative decision maker. We have Moyes.

Your comment about the bears made me smile, but look, you're twisting the facts to fit your anti-Moyes agenda, and it doesn't wash with me. So the semi against Liverpool counts but not the semi against Man United ? And you're ignoring the fact that the two cup ties we lost against Chelsea were when they were just about the best team in the land ?

And then you bring in the thing about derby matches, as if that's some kind of ultimate test of the manager (so all the games we've won against Manchester City and other top teams mean nothing in your eyes ?). But even in derby matches, the evidence is far from as damning as you suggest. Last season we had a 2-0 win and a 2-2 draw. This season, the defeat at Goodison was blamed by everybody on the Rodwell red card, and the defeat at Anfield can't be discussed without talking about Moyes's decision to rest key players. Every defeat against them hurts, and I understand the need to criticise some of Moyes's decisions, but I see no reason why we can't go out and beat them next season.
 
i would'nt say we bottle it in big games, because we beat city, drew to man u, beat spurs, beat chelsea, should have beaten arsenal no thanks to the linesman. its a case of having quality in depth to be able to do it in EVERY big game, okay this season the derbys... first was ruined due to atkinson's red to rodwell, second was actually pretty even, just gerrard was the differnce, and wembley, well.. i was actually there and to have their their third choice keeper in, we just didnt test him enough. we missed peinaar alot in a game like that.

a game like that just shows where we need to buy, obviously we need a young left back to cover for baines incase of injuries such as now, cant really have distin playing there coz he cant cross. a young centre back again for cover, distin is now 33/34 years old, also having 3 natural centre backs is not enough for a whole season for my liking, you need 4, just incase one gets injuried and ones suspended etc. a playmaker, like peinaar, but also a centre mid playmaker, like arteta was for us. and another out and out goal scorer, im loving the performances atm but im so worried what will happen to our goals if jelavic gets injuried. we need two strikers who naturally know where the goal is, this means at times we could also play two up top, ESPECIALLY AT HOME!!! two strikers who have good movement and link well would be so good to watch!!!
 
This season, the defeat at Goodison was blamed by everybody on the Rodwell red card
we shouldve parked the bus sooooo much to spoil the game as a protest against that red card- just hoofing the ball into row zz with all our players no more than 25yds out. fcken atkinson shiite con suarez waving/serious injury fcker- where was the FA looking into his feigning a broken leg- fckers................ fume over
 

some of yous are getting 'big' games mixed up with the biggest games.

We don't bottle the average big game (derby excepted)...but we do bottle our biggest games of each season. Remember how we got knocked out by Fiorentina? We bottled the first leg, played the game of our lives in the 2nd leg only to bottle the shoot-out.

Regarding shoot-outs, we did Chelsea...but what does that matter when we can't win the next round due to bottling it at home against a lower-league side?

We bottle it when it matters most. FACT.


Now that we've identified the problem, we need to identify the solution, hence this thread:

What is the solution to our main problem? (performing under pressure)
 
some of yous are getting 'big' games mixed up with the biggest games.

We don't bottle the average big game (derby excepted)...but we do bottle our biggest games of each season. Remember how we got knocked out by Fiorentina? We bottled the first leg, played the game of our lives in the 2nd leg only to bottle the shoot-out.Regarding shoot-outs, we did Chelsea...but what does that matter when we can't win the next round due to bottling it at home against a lower-league side?

We bottle it when it matters most. FACT.


Now that we've identified the problem, we need to identify the solution, hence this thread:

What is the solution to our main problem? (performing under pressure)

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On what basis do you come to that conclusion ?

The fact that a keeper made a good save from a penalty ?
 
Of course we bottle it.

Its not against big teams in the odd meaningless league game, its games that mean something.

Theres been times we couldve got champos league again, 07-08 I think it was, when we went neck and neck with the RS, lost to Florentina, and then lost 1.0 to the Rs at klanfield...season went to pot then.

Anytime we get a chance to move up the league and push on, we generally drop points against ****e teams.

Then theres the cup games.

Not enough snidey winners in the team.
 

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