The UFC and Mixed Martial Arts Thread

[Tubey]

Lol wut? Jones beat Cormier who was 15-0, Gustaffson who had only lost once, a Shogun who still wasn't quite past it, Rashad Evans, Rampage Jackson, Sonnen and Belfort, virtually dominating every fight.

Weidman's only notable wins are his double over Silva which both came in questionable and arguably fortunate circumstances, Machida and Munoz who is even still short of DC/Gustaffson/Shogun quality.

To say Silva and GSP have bigger legacies is correct IMO, but you can't have Weidman above Jones, no matter how much of a helmet the latter is.

Reason I'd place Weidman higher is because he beat Silva twice, who was invincible up until that point (I know the circumstances were strange but he still dominated). Not much higher mind.

It's not because of Jones' personality I don't rate him (I think Mayweather is the greatest technical fighter ever, and he's a pure bell) - it's just I see him as a guy who has a record similar to a boxer who has been by and large a flat track bully with the odd good name on his resume.

 

[Azzurri]

Reason I'd place Weidman higher is because he beat Silva twice, who was invincible up until that point (I know the circumstances were strange but he still dominated). Not much higher mind.

It's not because of Jones' personality I don't rate him (I think Mayweather is the greatest technical fighter ever, and he's a pure bell) - it's just I see him as a guy who has a record similar to a boxer who has been by and large a flat track bully with the odd good name on his resume.

To call Jones a flat track bully when he's beaten Shogun, Evans, Cormier, Gustaffson, Machida, Sonnen etc. is strange if you're then going to rate Weidman above him because of one win vs a late 30s Silva, a win vs Machida and being in a fight with a freak accident.

 

[FTY]

I think rumble had a better chance at Jones than Cormier, this is going to be a wrestling clinic.

Tbf as good as Cormier's wrestling is I don't see him as someone who relies solely on it, as in to hold people down for 3 rounds or whatever

 

[FTY]

I don't rate Jones that highly. Don't get me wrong, good and everything, but when people talk about him being the "Ali or Tyson of his sport", nowhere near. GSP and Silva are streets ahead of him in terms of overall legacy.

It's only the Evans win on his resume that I'm truly impressed by - everyone else has been done by someone else beforehand and on a downward slope. I'd even place Weidman on a higher pedestal than Jones.

GSP and Silva are years older than him, don't forget.

Jones could easily have done what he has been doing for 10 years or more, and considering he's already been champ for 3/4..pretty impressive.

On Weidman, beating Silva was impressive yeah, but the only real test he'd had is Machida who won a couple rounds against him; Jones finished Machida.

 

[Little Ralphy]

Reason I'd place Weidman higher is because he beat Silva twice, who was invincible up until that point (I know the circumstances were strange but he still dominated). Not much higher mind.

It's not because of Jones' personality I don't rate him (I think Mayweather is the greatest technical fighter ever, and he's a pure bell) - it's just I see him as a guy who has a record similar to a boxer who has been by and large a flat track bully with the odd good name on his resume.

@Azzurri pretty much covered this but wow. Anyone is entitled to their opinion but Weidman over Jones? Jack Slack pretty much predicted the downfall of Silva before it even happened. It was coming. Weidman rarely seems to even fight these days, as he's always injured. It'll be interesting to see 'NoTRT Vitor' against him and then he has Rockhold and Jacare to contend with. If Weidman beats all them, then maybe he can be held in that kind of esteem.

Jones has dominated most of his fights, brutally in most. Vera, Hammil and Shogun spring to mind as fights being almost difficult to watch. I think the difficulty with comparing Champions against non-champions or newly crowned Champions is that they're fighting top guys every time. GSP suffered this, and people used to btch about him not finishing fights, but if his retirement has proved anything it's how difficult it is to be dominant in this sport. GSP lived like a monk to maximise his talent, the UFC PR machine was in full force every time he had a fight to try and portray some vulnerability cos the guy was so dominant. I remember when he first came through, he was immense.

Silva's career has been tarnished with his recent drug issue. Shame cos he was great to watch.

I hope Jones cleans himself up and comes back strong, because you just know he's the kind of personality that'll keep coming out telling everyone how he was never beaten and how they had to take the belt away from him.... Would much rather Rumble knocked him out first.

 

[Phenom]

Tbf as good as Cormier's wrestling is I don't see him as someone who relies solely on it, as in to hold people down for 3 rounds or whatever

He uses it when he needs to and with Rumble's struggling I see Cormier putting a clinic on.

In a similar way to how he rag dolled Hendo and Barnett.

 

[Phenom]

Reason I'd place Weidman higher is because he beat Silva twice, who was invincible up until that point (I know the circumstances were strange but he still dominated). Not much higher mind.

It's not because of Jones' personality I don't rate him (I think Mayweather is the greatest technical fighter ever, and he's a pure bell) - it's just I see him as a guy who has a record similar to a boxer who has been by and large a flat track bully with the odd good name on his resume.

That post is just uneducated. I can't stand Jones, every fight he goes in to im rooting for the opposite corner but he's on course to be the greatest mixed martial artist of all time.

His record has the who's who of LHW fighters on there, he truly has cleaned out his division.

 

[Tubey]

That post is just uneducated. I can't stand Jones, every fight he goes in to im rooting for the opposite corner but he's on course to be the greatest mixed martial artist of all time.

His record has the who's who of LHW fighters on there, he truly has cleaned out his division.

I'm not saying he isn't great - I'm just saying the "Ali or Tyson of his sport" is not a tag I agree with, and there are others who I rate way more than him. Weidman isn't one of those. GSP and Silva most certainly are, and for Jones to be the "greatest mixed martial artist of all time" he has a massive way to go.

 

[FTY]

No one's disputing GSP/Silva have better legacies and are the best ever right now, people are talking potential Tubes, and he was right on track to be miles ahead of both of them.

Put it this way; if Jon Jones retired tomorrow he'd still be considered as one of the best of all time, easily and he's 27. Silva didn't even win the belt til he was 31.

 

[Little Ralphy]

He uses it when he needs to and with Rumble's struggling I see Cormier putting a clinic on.

In a similar way to how he rag dolled Hendo and Barnett.

What is Rumble struggling with? Is he injured?

Rumble handled Davis wrestling, granted Cormier is something different and can mix it up but I'm not convinced he can rag doll Rumble.

I imagine Cormier has been training with Cain this time round, and as he was mean't to be fighting Bader it'll be interesting how much wrestling he has been training for, as Rumble is a different animal to Bader.

It should be a good fight, if Cormier can take him down then perhaps Rumble's gas tank may let him down.

 

[FTY]

What is Rumble struggling with? Is he injured?

Rumble handled Davis wrestling, granted Cormier is something different and can mix it up but I'm not convinced he can rag doll Rumble.

I imagine Cormier has been training with Cain this time round, and as he was mean't to be fighting Bader it'll be interesting how much wrestling he has been training for, as Rumble is a different animal to Bader.

It should be a good fight, if Cormier can take him down then perhaps Rumble's gas tank may let him down.

Davis isn't a very good MMA wrestler tbh, he has good credentials but Rashad mauled him

 

[Phenom]

What is Rumble struggling with? Is he injured?

Rumble handled Davis wrestling, granted Cormier is something different and can mix it up but I'm not convinced he can rag doll Rumble.

I imagine Cormier has been training with Cain this time round, and as he was mean't to be fighting Bader it'll be interesting how much wrestling he has been training for, as Rumble is a different animal to Bader.

It should be a good fight, if Cormier can take him down then perhaps Rumble's gas tank may let him down.

Auto correct, that should be striking.

 

[FTY]

Somewhere in Sweden, Alexander Gustaffson is crying his eyes out

 

[Phenom]

I'm not saying he isn't great - I'm just saying the "Ali or Tyson of his sport" is not a tag I agree with, and there are others who I rate way more than him. Weidman isn't one of those. GSP and Silva most certainly are, and for Jones to be the "greatest mixed martial artist of all time" he has a massive way to go.

I'd put them all on a par to be honest, Jones probably has the most impressive record of them all, technically no losses and beat a lot of contenders in their prime.

 

[Little Ralphy]

Davis isn't a very good MMA wrestler tbh, he has good credentials but Rashad mauled him

Mauled? It's been a while but I remember that being an awful fight with hardly any action. Much like every Phil Davis fight to be fair.

Henderson was taken down at will by Jake Shields, he's far from a wrestler these days, just a walking H Bomb.

I'm not convinced Cormier will have it all his own way against Rumble, but he certainly has a better chance than he did against Jones. I think Rumble had a better chance against Jones than he does against DC.