Current Affairs The Labour Party

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Moomin said:
No difference in both of them.
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Know who I'll be voting for. The Tories are now scouring the poorer people on benefits bank accounts again, monthly, so if you work part time, 20 hours, are a single parent, but have the audacity, to not smoke, drink or gamble and worst still save you're money you will be penalised. Yes my conscience is clear, I will be voting proudly for labour.
 
mahermi1 said:
Know who I'll be voting for. The Tories are now scouring the poorer people on benefits bank accounts again, monthly, so if you work part time, 20 hours, are a single parent, but have the audacity, to not smoke, drink or gamble and worst still save you're money you will be penalised. Yes my conscience is clear, I will be voting proudly for labour.
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I live in a swing seat. I'll be voting Labour but I will be holding my nose.

Starmer is a liar. He came to Liverpool when campaigning and said he would never speak to the Scum. 12 months later he is writing articles for them.
 
davek said:
As Thatcher said when she was asked what her greatest achievement was: "Tony Blair and New Labour. We forced our opponents to change their minds".

And Blair accepted that: "I always thought my job was to build on some of the things she had done rather than reverse them".

What Starmer is suggesting though is not just building on Tory ideology, as with Blair, it is to capitulate to it.

Make no mistake, the guru of New Labour, Mandelson, who was always pushing that party as rightward as it would or could possibly go without causing a revolt has got his way now with Starmer. His leadership is the fin de siecle of that process. Mandelson is shaping Stamer's right wing party. His dream of parking tanks on Tory and Lib Dem lawns to gain power is coming to be.

That power though is not worth holding if you believe in anything like the re-distribution of wealth and greater democracy. You are now witnessing the end of what was the Labour Party here. It won't survive Starmer. There'll be a new party formed from the left within it and it'll fight the next general election and hopefully destroy the Former Labour Party.
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I would vote, to some extent, for the policies you promote, Dave, but your fellow Englishmen simply will not. Pragmatism wins elections in the UK. When I hear people go "Oh, Starmer is the same as Sunak, no difference", I think of "The EU is a neo-con corporate cabal. We'd be as well out". Well, we see how well that's worked out.

Starmer, Labour, and the EU are far from perfect. But they are ineluctably better than Sunak, the Tories, and Boris Johnson's Global Britain.
 
Moomin said:
I live in a swing seat. I'll be voting Labour but I will be holding my nose.

Starmer is a liar. He came to Liverpool when campaigning and said he would never speak to the Scum. 12 months later he is writing articles for them.
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Yes some of the things with him have become unpalatable, throughout Covid he came out of it really well, I would and have said in the past rather have Andy Burnham by a Country mile. But it's not just about the leader it's about the party as a whole and they are still hear and shoulders above the vermin in the Tory party.
 
mahermi1 said:
Know who I'll be voting for. The Tories are now scouring the poorer people on benefits bank accounts again, monthly, so if you work part time, 20 hours, are a single parent, but have the audacity, to not smoke, drink or gamble and worst still save you're money you will be penalised. Yes my conscience is clear, I will be voting proudly for labour.
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This is the problem innit.

I detest Starmer and his cronies like Lammy, Streeting, Reeves and others.

But I’l be darned if I wouldn’t vote for them ahead of any iteration of the Tory Party but in particular this neo fascist version of it.
 
Drico said:
I would vote, to some extent, for the policies you promote, Dave, but your fellow Englishmen simply will not. Pragmatism wins elections in the UK. When I hear people go "Oh, Starmer is the same as Sunak, no difference", I think of "The EU is a neo-con corporate cabal. We'd be as well out". Well, we see how well that's worked out.

Starmer, Labour, and the EU are far from perfect. But they are ineluctably better than Sunak, the Tories, and Boris Johnson's Global Britain.
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Any LP manifesto up to 1992 would be viewed by people now as having policies that are 'non-pragmatic' including the winning ones.

You have to fight to have policies to make a difference between Labour and the Tories or else it's not worth having power.

And the sad thing is that the Tory's are in such disarray that Starmer could easily keep many of his leadership election promises and still win a majority. But that's not what he and his handler Mandelson want. They want Labour to be a party of the right. They have zero feel for the Labour movement and aren't part of the tribe. They are technocrats who simply wish to hold power and they'll hollow out any party to achieve it. Both of them could and should have been (formally) Tories.

What a lost opportunity it is. A golden chance to redistribute power and wealth now the Tories are flattened but we'll get Red Toryism instead.

The establishment are heaving a huge sigh of relief that Starmer conned the Labour Party membership to become their Manchurian Candidate.
 
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