Current Affairs The Labour Party

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JimmyJeffers said:
He’s taking the ‘anyone but Tory’ votes for granted and is now trying to appeal to voters who have been happily voting for right wing loonies for the past decade.
Starmer is making it increasingly difficult for many people on the left to hold their nose and vote for him.
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Aye, he seems to have understood he'll need a majority to win.

He is going to upset the shouty minority on the left but if he is successful I'll judge them on what they do.

Iam.not sure the UK could cope with another tory clown show of corruption.
 
Spadge Vernacular said:
Aye, he seems to have understood he'll need a majority to win.

He is going to upset the shouty minority on the left but if he is successful I'll judge them on what they do.

Iam.not sure the UK could cope with another tory clown show of corruption.
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It’s not just a shouty minority I think. He’s taken votes for granted off the back of how terrible the opposition are. It’s a sad state of affairs.
Many people don’t agree with @davek on this subject, and i understand their position, but this iteration of the Labour Party represents the final nail in the coffin for mainstream left politics in the U.K. for another generation.
 
JimmyJeffers said:
He’s taking the ‘anyone but Tory’ votes for granted and is now trying to appeal to voters who have been happily voting for right wing loonies for the past decade.
Starmer is making it increasingly difficult for many people on the left to hold their nose and vote for him.
Click to expand...

Hard to take I admit, but you need to win the middle ground to get into office, much as you would hate to admit, me too, if you win the middle ground you get elected.

When Thatcher ran to power she appealed to left sided voters, with her little shopping bag for £5 and she won. She, spits, realised that there weren't enough Tories to win an election and adapted.
Whether we like it or not, Starmer has to do much the same, such as Blair did with " New Labour" and like him or not he got 3 election victories on the trott, unheard of with the Labour Party throughout history.
Adapt or die, like we have been doing the last 13 years, dying on our feet.
Or you could hug a tree, pray to you're One MP and vote Green...
 
JimmyJeffers said:
It’s not just a shouty minority I think. He’s taken votes for granted off the back of how terrible the opposition are. It’s a sad state of affairs.
Many people don’t agree with @davek on this subject, and i understand their position, but this iteration of the Labour Party represents the final nail in the coffin for mainstream left politics in the U.K. for another generation.
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You should not take a single thing that @davek posts seriously. His MO is that of a contrarian troll.

This is going to be a messy battle as the tories will say and do anything to win. If Labour don't fight tooth and nail Sunak and co will continue to dismantle our lives and country.

As I say, I believe that Starmer understands the types of things needed to win and if he does (please lord) I'll judge him on what he delivers.
 
mahermi1 said:
Hard to take I admit, but you need to win the middle ground to get into office, much as you would hate to admit, me too, if you win the middle ground you get elected.

When Thatcher ran to power she appealed to left sided voters, with her little shopping bag for £5 and she won. She, spits, realised that there weren't enough Tories to win an election and adapted.
Whether we like it or not, Starmer has to do much the same, such as Blair did with " New Labour" and like him or not he got 3 election victories on the trott, unheard of with the Labour Party throughout history.
Adapt or die, like we have been doing the last 13 years, dying on our feet.
Or you could hug a tree, pray to you're One MP and vote Green...
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Spot on. History shows this to be true.
 
mahermi1 said:
Hard to take I admit, but you need to win the middle ground to get into office, much as you would hate to admit, me too, if you win the middle ground you get elected.

When Thatcher ran to power she appealed to left sided voters, with her little shopping bag for £5 and she won. She, spits, realised that there weren't enough Tories to win an election and adapted.
Whether we like it or not, Starmer has to do much the same, such as Blair did with " New Labour" and like him or not he got 3 election victories on the trott, unheard of with the Labour Party throughout history.
Adapt or die, like we have been doing the last 13 years, dying on our feet.
Or you could hug a tree, pray to you're One MP and vote Green...
Click to expand...
As Thatcher said when she was asked what her greatest achievement was: "Tony Blair and New Labour. We forced our opponents to change their minds".

And Blair accepted that: "I always thought my job was to build on some of the things she had done rather than reverse them".

What Starmer is suggesting though is not just building on Tory ideology, as with Blair, it is to capitulate to it.

Make no mistake, the guru of New Labour, Mandelson, who was always pushing that party as rightward as it would or could possibly go without causing a revolt has got his way now with Starmer. His leadership is the fin de siecle of that process. Mandelson is shaping Stamer's right wing party. His dream of parking tanks on Tory and Lib Dem lawns to gain power is coming to be.

That power though is not worth holding if you believe in anything like the re-distribution of wealth and greater democracy. You are now witnessing the end of what was the Labour Party here. It won't survive Starmer. There'll be a new party formed from the left within it and it'll fight the next general election and hopefully destroy the Former Labour Party.
 
Tin-Tin said:
Courting the Tory votes but its still disgusting to see given what she done to people.

Tories out, electoral reform then an actual proper left wing new Labour party needs to be formed. This one has been hijacked.
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A Thatcher worshipping, S*n article writing leader of the 'Labour' Party.

What interesting times we live through.
 
davek said:
As Thatcher said when she was asked what her greatest achievement was: "Tony Blair and New Labour. We forced our opponents to change their minds".

And Blair accepted that: "I always thought my job was to build on some of the things she had done rather than reverse them".

What Starmer is suggesting though is not just building on Tory ideology, as with Blair, it is to capitulate to it.

Make no mistake, the guru of New Labour, Mandelson, who was always pushing that party as rightward as it would or could possibly go without causing a revolt have got their way now with Starmer. His leadership is the fin de siecle of that process. Mandelson is shaping Stamer's right wing party. His dream of parking tanks on Tory and Lib Dem lawns to gain power is coming to be.

That power though is not worth holding if you believe in anything like the re-distribution of wealth and greater democracy. You are now witnessing the end of what was the Labour Party here. It won't survive Starmer. There'll be a new party formed from the left within it and it'll fight the next general election and hopefully destroy the Former Labour Party.
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And itself totally, just what the tory media want to hear Dave. The idealistic views we all supported during the 60's and 70's and early 80's, y'know strikes galore are gone lad and we all know it, I was one of them. I want Labour to be leftist and middle ground not what you're bullshit is spreading, more right wing than the tories. Calm down you're becoming hysterical. Strange how you suddenly become a Green party activist almost overnight, who do you think will be more likely to bring some of them policies in Labour or Conservative ? Because Dave they are the only ones getting in power so get real. Labour has to appeal to the middle ground, that's what wins elections.
 
JimmyJeffers said:
Labour should also have been making significant gains in Scotland but looks like they’ve given up on that completely. Thatcher is almost unanimously hated north of the border.
Scottish Labour should move to split from the party.
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Merge with the Greens, hey presto left-wing coalition. I heard Patterson votes Scottish Labour tho, might be a problem.
 
Starmer's 'Labour' Party:

  • backs genocide in Gaza
  • supports big business
  • admires Thatcherism
  • hands out interviews to the S*n, writes columns for it, and begs it for endorsements
  • believes illegal immigrants should be detained in concentration camps in France
  • will carry on with austerity
  • refuses to tax the rich
  • now refuses to back an end to the two-child benefit limit which hits low income families
  • won't end student debt
  • ditched “support for common ownership of failing services like rail, mail, energy and water"
  • will allow the further outsourcing of NHS services to the private sector
  • punishes its MPs for standing on picket lines supporting trade unions...the unions that formed the party in the first place
  • will not discipline party officers found guilty of racism in the Forde Report

Let's face it, it's hardly worth voting the Tories out really is it?

There is no way I'll have that on my conscience - voting for scum who've put together that policy platform.
 
davek said:
As Thatcher said when she was asked what her greatest achievement was: "Tony Blair and New Labour. We forced our opponents to change their minds".

And Blair accepted that: "I always thought my job was to build on some of the things she had done rather than reverse them".

What Starmer is suggesting though is not just building on Tory ideology, as with Blair, it is to capitulate to it.

Make no mistake, the guru of New Labour, Mandelson, who was always pushing that party as rightward as it would or could possibly go without causing a revolt has got his way now with Starmer. His leadership is the fin de siecle of that process. Mandelson is shaping Stamer's right wing party. His dream of parking tanks on Tory and Lib Dem lawns to gain power is coming to be.

That power though is not worth holding if you believe in anything like the re-distribution of wealth and greater democracy. You are now witnessing the end of what was the Labour Party here. It won't survive Starmer. There'll be a new party formed from the left within it and it'll fight the next general election and hopefully destroy the Former Labour Party.
Click to expand...

This new left wing party that you’re dreaming of, will be made up of dreary middle class P/P/E students, university lecturer types and upper middle class coffee shop socialists. Who drive 4x4, kids go to public school and live in Georgian townhouses in areas that used to be edgy.

It will have less political clout than the Green Party.

The old left is dead, get over it. All the whinging in the world isn‘t bringing it back.

Have you thought of moving to Russia or China, you’d be a lot happier over there ?
 
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