The Case for the Defence

[marsh]

I suggested in August that we sign another Centre back and people laughed/was unsure, sadly I think I was right, having Keane and Tarkowski will cost us, they're both too slow and can't push up the pitch due to this. And Tarkowski has been alot worse than Keane which I didn't expect.

 

[Zatara]

And we blew the bulk of our summer budget on a young winger who isn’t ready (despite playing a full premier league season last year), and a young striker who isn't ready either, even though every Everton supporter in the land knew we needed a right back and probably a new left back.

We spent around £150mil and he cost £35mil rising to £40mil so its not the bulk.

He'll turn out to be the best signing of the window. The shocker was KDH who shouldnt be in the 11. That would have covered a RB.

Zat, I’m generally on the same page as you re which players have a future and which don’t, what’s your issue with Jake O’B tho? I think Jarrad and Jake can potentially be the perfect centre back partnership, a Jags and Joleon for the 2020s.

I'm not sure we've seen him perform to a top level at centre back?

We've seen him at RB and kind-of a back 3 but not as a standout in a pairing.

I agree that he and Branthwaite could be great together but another thing is that with Branthwaite now entering an area where injuries become a concern, we really need another centre back to come in.

When we look at the money Arsenal and Spurs (just an example i made yesterday) are spending on defence we need a top player to come in.

Ideally we see Obrien and Branthwaite together and they develop a partnership.

 

[Efcjake]

I think it's Tarkowski who needs a week or two off and letting O'Brien play in the middle with Jimmy Garner right back.

 

[Seathestars]

Score first in a lot of these games, which we could have done, and we wouldn't be having this debate, goals breed confidence.

 

[johnjoeefc]

Without Branthwaite it’s an extremely average defence. The Michael Keane fan club can squeal all they want about whether he’s been better than Tarkwoski or not but it’s just two sides of the same coin covered in crap and completely irrelevant. Being in the best form of your career and only being slightly better than a player in the worst form of his entire career isn’t the brag that some people think it is. When Branthwaite doesn’t play, we leak 1-2 goals per game.

I’d put Jake OBrien in the middle with Tarkwoski and hope that Tarkwoski’s form improves without Keane next to him

For me some people just hate on Keane and to put the blame on him for Tarkowski not performing is laughable. Keane seems to be better than Tarkowski in other departments (passing, scoring) and as Keane has dropped the mistakes and the other is making them regularly its time Tarkowski is dropped.

Also the defence is only an issue when you dont score up the other end. The gaping problem is the lack of goals and how that negatively affects confidence throughout the team.

 

[Zatara]

For me some people just hate on Keane and to put the blame on him for Tarkowski not performing is laughable. Keane seems to be better than Tarkowski in other departments (passing, scoring) and as Keane has dropped the mistakes and the other is making them regularly its time Tarkowski is dropped.

Also the defence is only an issue when you dont score up the other end. The gaping problem is the lack of goals and how that negatively affects confidence throughout the team.

Look how anyone next to Keane plays far worse than next to anyone else.

Look how deep the defence has to sit to allow for Keane.

Keane could have motm every game and he still shouldnt start.

 

[alpethsm]

I know it's harsh (as he has improved) but we always concede loads of chances with Keane in the side, he's too slow to turn and sits back to cover affecting the structure of the side leaving a hole between defence and midfield.

It's been 8 years and it's always the same.

Jake and Tarkowski for me.

 

[hallamblue]

Given our current squad I would play 3 Centre halves. We don't have a decent full back at the club so at home I'd be looking to play 3-4-3 and away from home 3-5-1-1. We are an unbalanced team with people playing out of position and strikers who can't hold the ball up. When you have that you struggle with transitions from the opposition and if the defence isn't set you'll concede chances. A possession based 3-4-3/3-5-1-1 could change that, but it's mainly down to the players not being very good so that needs addressing pretty quickly as well.

 

[ElGato]

For me some people just hate on Keane and to put the blame on him for Tarkowski not performing is laughable. Keane seems to be better than Tarkowski in other departments (passing, scoring) and as Keane has dropped the mistakes and the other is making them regularly its time Tarkowski is dropped.

Also the defence is only an issue when you dont score up the other end. The gaping problem is the lack of goals and how that negatively affects confidence throughout the team.

Not true if we need to score 2 or 3 every game to be in with a chance of winning is it.

Currently we're shipping 3ish big chances per game

 

[johnjoeefc]

Not true if we need to score 2 or 3 every game to be in with a chance of winning is it.

Currently we're shipping 3ish big chances per game

We have scored an average of one goal a game. A worse ratio than last season

 

[NilSatisOptimum]

Look how anyone next to Keane plays far worse than next to anyone else.

Look how deep the defence has to sit to allow for Keane.

Keane could have motm every game and he still shouldnt start.

Keane and Tarkoski are an awful pairing to have at the back. Essentially both slow on pace. And the two full/ wing backs for different reasons are for the most part crap.

Personally I would go flat 5 in midfield and defence barley moves over halfway unless its dead ball play.

Be amazed if the captain is dropped!

 

[ElGato]

We have scored an average of one goal a game. A worse ratio than last season

We definitely should be scoring more based on the possession we have and the chances we are creating. I'm not denying that.

But what I'm saying (and what this thread is about) is that the data shows that we are weaker at the back than going forwards (comparatively speaking, when looking at chances created vs conceded, to the rest of the premier league).

Blaming the lack of a clinical striker or a goal scoring no.10 for how open we are at the back seems a little wide of the mark. And sure, if we could score more, then it would be less of an issue... but that wouldn't change the bottom line: which is that we are a team that is easy to play through and create chances against.

 

[Joey66]

The transfer window doesn't open until January friend

DM knew this last JUNE.....

 

[Curtis]

Unless Aznou steps up and breaks into the team...we need 3 new starting defenders.

Basically, Branthwaite + 3.

Looking at how much Spurs paid for theirs;

Van der Ven £43mil
Udogie £20mil
Porro £39mil
Gray £40mil
Romero £42.5mil

Thats the level of quality that costs money.

Bournemouth' replaced the majority of their backline which they sold for close to 200 million this window and bought the replacements along with one loan all regularly playing for around 65 million. Obviously it's not always that easy but it can be done. They are currently 2nd in the league

 

[Vaughan]

Keane is having a decent spell but he's a back foot defender. all his best work is clearances from deep and last ditch blocks

essentially the sign of a bad defender who is too deep and out of position

a bit liek Hibbert, he made a few slideys so everyone thought he was solid but he shouldnt have been having to make those tackles in the first place.

this would be fine if we were looking to soak up pressure every game, but we're not. we have actually played on the front foot in every game and looked to have control of the football, except for the first halves against Leeds and Liverpool. so when we end up losing the ball there is a huge gap between attack and defense which opposition sides are exploiting

with a higher line and a more aggressive defensive unit you can squeeze the opposition and turn the ball back over instantly and go back on the attack in the oppositions half.

Keane was a needs must at beginning of season, but OBrien needs to partner Tarkowski for now, and Garner will give us more balance and threat on the right.

garner out of midfield also means one of (if not both) Rohl or KDH will play in CM, which i think would make us less easy to play through as both seem that bit more solid and aggressive than Gana, and btter at covering the ground

Garner is in great form on the ball, off the ball i think he's too lightweight to be in there for us. if he played for a side that had 70% of possession every game fine, but we dont. We are too easy to play through currently I think which impacts the defence.

OBrien is also playing like a centre half who is being shifted to right back. last year he played like a lad who was just determined to make an impact no matter where he played and was effective. Now he looks like what he is, a 6ft6 centre half at right back, which isn't really sustainable for what we are trying to do with the football when we have possession of it

Pep did play Stones at right back for a spell, but Stones would drift into central midfield when they had the ball (which was all the time) and dictate the tempo from there. he's also levels above OBrien. OBrien isnt offering anything offensively except for at set plays and this is hampering us

mykolenko is just not good enough and I think is being shown up without Branthwaite mopping upafter him. his lack of any attacking ability is so stark now that he's supporting Grealish, instead of someone ike McNeil or Harrison, and under Dyche we didnt really play through them anyway, we just hoped for a set piece