The 5/4/2016 pro Martinez thread

[CahillsCornerFlag]

All teams can go through a bad patch .

What, imo, needs to be done is the manager has to reconstruct the team. The confidence level is low, I think the players expect to concede goals, expect to lose games and that is a hard mentality to lose.

The manager needs to rebuild a team based on not losing, forget about winning for a little while.
We have forward players like Deulofeu, Lukaku, Lennon and Barkley who can win a game for you on their own but a defensive spine needs to be put in place.
Maybe , we need to be a little dull, a little boring, a little safe, a lot more defensive.

Addressing this step by step;

1. 18 months can't be swept under the carpet as a 'bad patch'.
2. Why do you think the confidence level is low in the first place? Tactically inept, stubborn, losing games constantly.
3. We have that spine now, but we won't next year. Lukaku is already gone barring a miracle change in management. Stones won't stick around for long either if this dross continues. The players don't believe in him and his methods any more.
4. 'Forget about winning for a little while', you mean carry on exactly as we are now then?

People are burying their head in the sand I'm afraid, and are in for a very rude awakening next year if this bloke is still in charge.

 

[Thomasc]

He doesn't wear cardigans, hasn't got ginger hair ans isn't likely to be pursued by a CL club...there, it's easy this positivity stuff!

 

[kithnou]

Addressing this step by step;

1. 18 months can't be swept under the carpet as a 'bad patch'.
2. Why do you think the confidence level is low in the first place? Tactically inept, stubborn, losing games constantly.
3. We have that spine now, but we won't next year. Lukaku is already gone barring a miracle change in management. Stones won't stick around for long either if this dross continues. The players don't believe in him and his methods any more.
4. 'Forget about winning for a little while', you mean carry on exactly as we are now then?

People are burying their head in the sand in afraid, and are in for a very rude awakening next year if this bloke is still in charge.

Positive thread mate. Shake shake shake, shake your booty brother

 

[CahillsCornerFlag]

Positive thread mate. Shake shake shake, shake your booty brother

Positivity I can do mate, delusion I can't and won't be an enabler to

 

[kithnou]

Positivity I can do mate, delusion I can't and won't be an enabler to

Dance with me my blue brother. You know you want to.

 

[oldblue]

It's a positive thread right? Ok here I go.
Woohoo yes baby. Get down and boogie. Do a little dance, make a little love...get down tonight!
A two season bad patch. Woop woop!!
All teams go through them. So all is good and Roberto is just going through one. For two seasons.
Woohoo.
Phenomenal.
Get down!

Sorry but if that's the level that the arguments against him are at then it reinforces my feelings that we are not in the right mood to be making decisions.
The post you responded to seemed sensible enough to me and not even that pro Martinez

 

[kithnou]

Sorry but if that's the level that the arguments against him are at then it reinforces my feelings that we are not in the right mood to be making decisions.
The post you responded to seemed sensible enough to me and not even that pro Martinez

'Going through a bad patch'?
Please feel free to rebuttal.
Yes the post I responded to was fine. I have no problem with it. I am querying the above though.

 

[Foot Long Hot Dog]

Using Kendall as a reason for Martinez to be given more time is a flawed and emotionally charged argument imo

Martinez has proved, both here and at his previous club, that he can't organise a defence, and his sides will always leak goals. It's easy to play attacking football, when you don't give a stuff about what happens when the opposition catch you up field. He lacks the pragmatism needed to produce a side that has any chance of repeating what Kendall's achieved. As he's obsessed with his wretched philosophy where the football is seemingly more important than the results in his World.

A cup win would almost certainly save him, but anything short of that should see him emptying his desk come May. Fine margins indeed.

 

[Jimmy1]

Well it's really not. But as a few posters have said it would be nice to have a thread were people on both sides of argument have actually looked at the pros and cons in a sensible way

What are the pros? Young team? Good football? Means nothing if your consistently not winning games and finishing in the bottom half of the table for two consecutive seasons. 9 league wins all season 5 of which against the bottom 3.

All I see in the arguments for keeping in Martinez are drenched in delusion. Usually its we'll sign him, get a new this blah blah. We will be losing players the way its going and any quality players we might be interested in will be more interested in the likes of West Ham, Stoke, Southampton etc.

 

[oldblue]

'Going through a bad patch'?
Please feel free to rebuttal.
Yes the post to responded to was fine. I have no problem with it.

You don't agree. Fair enough. But it's how some people feel. Your post has made me more pro Martnez than I was earlier in the day

 

[The Reverand]

Because it hasn't worked so far under Martinez doesn't mean it's 'never' going to work now.

Under Kendall's first few seasons we were far worse off than what we are now... The football was terrible, the results were terrible, and little sign of any on-pitch progress. The fans were absolutely livid and we all wanted him gone.

Also, under Kendall (82/83) there were far fewer positives than what we see today. The football was awful and the thought of us dominating the League, Cup AND Europe was (thinking back) totally laughable.

And fwiw. I've not listened to a Martinez pre or post match interview in 2 years. I can't stand the man. And I actually need to look away whenever the cringeworthy bellend speaks.

BUT. He is responsible for the best football i've seen us play in 25 years. And unlike Kendall (more fool me) i'm not ready to give up on him just yet.

He's got so many lessons to learn (just like Howard did), but this manager given two more seasons could make us challenge at the very top.

That said. IF there is a mass player rebellion - then he needs to go... Even the best and hardest of them all (Mourinho) couldn't fight that tyde.

I totally disagree - he is too stubborn to change.
The biggest catalyst for the turnaround in the eighties was threefold:
Harvey becoming first team coach
Signing Reid and Gray - experienced players but more importantly winners who hated losing and were leaders who looked after the younger lads on the the pitch. If we had one of these type of players we would be 20 points better off - when was the last time you seen one of our so called senior players rollicking somebody?
I hope I'm wrong but fear I'm not.
Taxi for Martinez

 

[kithnou]

You don't agree. Fair enough. But it's how some people feel. Your post has made me more pro Martnez than I was earlier in the day

I respect your stance mate. I really do. May I ask for a response to my 'bad patch'?
If I am out of line in asking such questions in this thread I will happily apologise and refrain.

 

[oldblue]

What are the pros? Young team? Good football? Means nothing if your consistently not winning games and finishing in the bottom half of the table for two consecutive seasons. 9 league wins all season 5 of which against the bottom 3.

All I see in the arguments for keeping in Martinez are drenched in delusion. Usually its we'll sign him, get a new this blah blah. We will be losing players the way its going and any quality players we might be interested in will be more interested in the likes of West Ham, Stoke, Southampton etc.

Good alliteration but saying arguments are drenched in delusion doesn't make much sense to me. Personally I've spent years pondering what could make Everton successful. I'm very grounded and I see possibilities and little to think things will get worse.
You've made a lot of presumptions about what will happen but are they backed up by anything but your feelings

 

[oldblue]

I respect your stance mate. I really do. May I ask for a response to my 'bad patch'?
If I am out of line in asking such questions in this thread I will happily apologise and refrain.

I read the post a lot more in depth and the opening line was hardly the point.
It's a bad patch but not even as bad as I've seen. Not sure it's a point of debate.

 

[kithnou]

I read the post a lot more in depth and the opening line was hardly the point.
It's a bad patch but not even as bad as I've seen. Not sure it's a point of debate.

It was a good post. I respect it.
The bad patch. How long has it been going for?