Should we really blame Moyes?

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Omg Yakubu was a GREAT piece of business. 11.25m for 21 goals in his first year at 24 yrs old? Fantastic business. He was carrying that on into his second season (4 goals in the first 6 games) then got injured. He was never the same. Hard luck.

Marouane Fellaini. Proved in the 09-10 season that he is worth a hell of a lot more than the money we paid for him. We'd make a good 5 to 10m on the original transfer fee if we sold him now and he's still only 23. Excellent buy. The fact that you compare him to Carsley... I actually cannot find words to describe how ludicrous that is in every possible way. I know RS fans that openly admit that Fellaini is "class".

Baines Bought for £6m. Worth, in my opinion, in excess of £30m. At least £25m. Still only 26/7. One of Moyes's best.

Yes Moyes has made mistakes with money Beattie, Kroldrup, Bily (so far) Davies (to be fair, only £4m). But Johnson was not a mistake. He was a great servant and we sold him for a £2m profit Nuff said. And Neville was not a mistake in the slightest. That's outrageous. He was never a class player but he's one of Moyes' better signings simply because of what he brought to the team in his first 3 years especially. £3.5m = bargain.

And Lescott ffs. Bought for £4m, sold for £24m after helping us immensely to our best 3 years since the 80s.

Some of your valuations of our players are well below the mark. I still cannot believe you compared Felli to Carsley. Jagielka's one you forgot there too. What a buy he was for £4m and even he's been unfortunately severely weakened by injury to this day. Overall cost of Arteta, Pienaar, Howard, Cahill, Baines = less than £15m. Think of the value of the years of service put in by these players. One thing you CANNOT possibly question about Moyes is his eye for a player.
You seem to have not read my post. I never wrote that Moyes could not spot a bargain, on the contrary I highlighted Baines, Lescott and Jagielka. I'm also not saying that Fellaini is a bad player, but for £15 m. I expected more, also when I compared him to Carsley that was for the role that Moyes wants him to play - ball winner, shielding the defense, which Carsley was a beast at. If Fellaini was allowed to roam forward more like he does for Belgium and at Standard he might be worth the fee, but for the role that Moyes wants him to take I just feel that the £15 m. could be spend better.
And yes Yakubu was great before the injury and just when we all thought he was back and got a goal (Liverpool and Stoke) Moyes decided that he would rather play Saha. So yeah the fee might be ok, but when you only want a player for two season, before you decide that he just cannot hack it anymore.
 
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You seem to have not read my post. I never wrote that Moyes could not spot a bargain, on the contrary I highlighted Baines, Lescott and Jagielka. I'm also not saying that Fellaini is a bad player, but for £15 m. I expected more, also when I compared him to Carsley that was for the role that Moyes wants him to play - ball winner, shielding the defense, which Carsley was a beast at. If Fellaini was allowed to roam forward more like he does for Belgium and at Standard he might be worth the fee, but for the role that Moyes wants him to take I just feel that the £15 m. could be spend better.
And yes Yakubu was great before the injury and just when we all thought he was back and got a goal (Liverpool and Stoke) Moyes decided that he would rather play Saha. So yeah the fee might be ok, but when you only want a player for two season, before you decide that he just cannot hack it anymore.

Carsley was good for strong tackling and defended the back four well. Fellaini offers skills miles out of Carsley's league. £15m is not a whole lot these days and for someone that good and that young he's a great investment and proved his as I said before he got so badly injured.

I believe Yak wanted out along with compatriot Yobo and Moyes didn't want to play him. He's wasn't exactly a model pro while he was here. What can't be disputed is goal tallies before the injury. He was a late signing that first year as well. It would probably have been more had he been signed before the start of the season. Nowadays people pay megabucks for 20 goals a season. Look at the ridiculous money people are paying for Darren Bent. And his record isn't as good as Yak's.
 
Just a thought on Moyes' dejectedness. My manager here in Newcastle works tunnel security on matchday at the Sports Direct Arena (heh!) and says he's never heard swearing like what was coming from the Everton dressing room at half time last Saturday. This is a man that I'm sure has heard a few choice words in his time (He's 61) and was still shocked by what he heard. I didn't have the heart to ask was it inspirational swearing, or furious "you're all useless" swearing. Gives a little insight into what's going on behind the scene's of the club. Either Moyes is utterly fed up and finished, or he's trying but has lost the dressing room. Still don't see this improving anytime soon, and I'm a glass-half-full Blue.
 
Just a thought on Moyes' dejectedness. My manager here in Newcastle works tunnel security on matchday at the Sports Direct Arena (heh!) and says he's never heard swearing like what was coming from the Everton dressing room at half time last Saturday. This is a man that I'm sure has heard a few choice words in his time (He's 61) and was still shocked by what he heard. I didn't have the heart to ask was it inspirational swearing, or furious "you're all useless" swearing. Gives a little insight into what's going on behind the scene's of the club. Either Moyes is utterly fed up and finished, or he's trying but has lost the dressing room. Still don't see this improving anytime soon, and I'm a glass-half-full Blue.

Tim Howard's tourettes takes a backwards step, very sad.
 

Of course we should blame Moyes, and I really want him out as I wrote two weeks ago:
I have wanted Moyes out since the start of last season. Yes yes I know he has done wonders for the club, but he cannot continue to live on past achievements. The highpoint in his Everton career is the FA Cup final against Chelsea, and since that defeat he has looked disinterested, negative and generally like a wounded animal.
I cannot stand the media's obsession that he is such a good manager, they don't even bother to look at how we perform when we meet a club with a huge budget. It's all ok to loose to these teams and not doing anything to change things around - this is Moyes, the man who has done so much for "poor little Everton. God they are lucky they have him."
He has after ten years being completely in charge created a squad that consists of some exiting young players (Rodwell, Vellios, Fellaini and of course Barkley), faithful servants who will never win you a game, but can be counted on to at least work their socks of (Neville, Hibbert, Jagielka, Osman, and of lately Cahill), and a group of misfits that either cannot get a game or somehow only need to have one fit leg in order to start (Bilyaletdinov, Heitinga, Strach, Drenthe, Anichebe and Saha). The squad has no pace, no creativity, and no strikers.
It is clear that tactically Moyes has not evolved since Cahill came to the club in 2004. Whenever he has a full squad to select from, Moyes fails. It beggars belief that he still selects his team around the Cahill, despite it being clear that the only one who benefits from it is Cahill. How many teams in the PL, have their left back as their must creative player?
Moyes' recent whinging after each game about the difference in the money spend by the opposition is also getting embarrassing. Yes there has been no investment in the team, but if we are to believe Moyes, he's the one who is making the call about who gets sold and bought - basically the squad he has is the one he has assembled. So he is responsible for no pace, no strikers and only one winger (Drenthe) who is only on loan, but cannot get a game.
This is not to say that we don't have the players at the club to make the top10, we have. But when more or less the same 11 play each week and the overall gameplan is damage control, and not to win it is bound to go wrong. And surprise surprise it will not change no matter how many times you try it.
When Moyes goes out and say, come to Everton, here we give youth a chance, it is a lie. Youth is only given a chance, when injuries force Moyes' hand, when the team more or less picks itself, because there is no one else is when the results arrive. He did it with Rooney, did it with Rodwell and is doing it to Barkley now. IF you're good enough you're old enough is something that is generally agreed upon, but Moyes does not see it that way.
This is not a kneejerk reaction to the Chelsea game, but a sum-up of how I have felt with Moyes since the start of last season. I have reached the point where I don't know who we are playing until the day before, I almost don't care if I don't catch the game on the telly, and most crazy I have started to hope that we get hammered every time we play, so that Kenwrigth's hand is forced and he sacks Moyes. Moyes needs to realise that he has been given everything at this club, except money, he has total control and is the highest paid member of Everton FC.
PLease Celtic sack Lennon and come asking for Moyes.


This thread was really quite good. Some good opinions and I like the fact that teams have basically worked us out and we possibly need a dramatic change of tactics to compete again, shake things up. But we'd need a few more Premiership quality players to do this. And Moyes knows that too.

But I've highlighted the above post as the real highlight. Or should I say low-light. No-one is immune from getting boned in this game, it keeps you on your toes. If Moyes became available do you see the amount of clubs lining up to get him? I do. His inbox would resemble Gazza after a Mars Bar Binge. I understand your in a dark place, Dane, but FFS, YOU are whats wrong with the club, and thats why your interest is on the wane. Fecking Prawn Sandwich brigade. You'll be supporting Major League Softball next year. Let's give youth a chance, and see how fast we get relegated. Youngsters tend to get big heads and if you give them too much too quickly, their heads explode. Any job on the entire world has an apprenticeship program formally or not. It usually take s a few years in any gig to really understand what the hell your doing out there. Barkley was in the side, and then he maybe got a big head or he slacked off as kids do, and he got benched for a bit. Get his sh!t in order. Rooney is the face of the English game around the world for those of you who don't get off the island too often, and that is the Stirling work of one D. Moyes. You may the brightest talent of your generation but step out of line and your getting splinters on your arse for a couple of weeks like the rest of the nearly men. And so kiddo doesn't take this on the chin, he's got family coming out the woodwork telling him how brilliant of a 17 year old kid he is and you should get a better deal. Relationships fracture, bad things are said and the whole situation blows up. Fans turn on the Manager because WE LOVE THAT KID and he can do no wrong. Moyes will not stay our Manager forever. This is a fact. Will he ever bring success? Who knows. I'd say not without a serious cash injection, or the next generation of sh!t hot kids early nieties Man U style.

I'm sort of having a go at you, because I think you are over-reacting and I think you are better than that. Whats the solution? Obviously sack everyone, according to you and the Kenwrongers, and then we'll be awesome. I can't remember who, but someone said in a post basically we've been beaten by a couple of dodgy ref calls, an own goal and a wonder strike among other things. It's a bit of luck and that sh!t hot striker we are missing, and the fact that EVERY YEAR we play well in one half of the year, and brilliant in the other half.
 
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Just a thought on Moyes' dejectedness. My manager here in Newcastle works tunnel security on matchday at the Sports Direct Arena (heh!) and says he's never heard swearing like what was coming from the Everton dressing room at half time last Saturday. This is a man that I'm sure has heard a few choice words in his time (He's 61) and was still shocked by what he heard. I didn't have the heart to ask was it inspirational swearing, or furious "you're all useless" swearing. Gives a little insight into what's going on behind the scene's of the club. Either Moyes is utterly fed up and finished, or he's trying but has lost the dressing room. Still don't see this improving anytime soon, and I'm a glass-half-full Blue.

Very glad to hear that. "Given up" my ****ing arse.
 
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