2021/22 Rafael Benitez

[little elfin]

How many consecutive defeats is good enough to ditch him away?

 

[Zatara]

Certainly acts like one. Interesting how nobody who says Benitez is a terrible manager, should get sacked, will relegate Everton, has the conviction to back what they are saying. Talk is cheap.

I respect everyone's right to dislike him for his past association. You want him out at all cost, even to the disadvantage of the club, totally understandable. I think he's a good manager and needs time. We agree to disagree like proper well brought up adults. But talking wham all the time trying to justify your hatred by inventing all sorts of "reasons" in order to appear unbiased, smart or logical is boring.

As opposed to 'deliberately' mis-reading posts and stating that peoples opinions are based around playing computer games?

I must be living in another dimension where a poster (thats you) is accusing another of being a child, with the goal of taking the 'moral high ground'.

The forum split certainly has a few 'peculiar' posters supporting a manager who has--in every possible way--taken the team backwards this season.

@ForeverBlue92 for example has admitted that Benitez is (at least) two levels below the previous manager.

@Tubey also doesnt consider Benitez to be a top manager.

Both of these posters make a fair point which is that Everton is in a holding pattern due to 'Profit and Sustainability' regulations. As such, they feel that Benitez should be given leeway during this period to move on dross players and rebuild the squad -- they feel that Benitez is 'good enough' to do this.

Most posters are disagreeing based on their opinions differing from that viewpoint.

To rip apart your points:

A: You have taken the view that posters want Benitez sacked as he was a former Liverpool manager.

This is incorrect for most posters here. This argument has been done to death on this very thread and if you bothered to read the opposing viewpoints you would have some grasp of the arguments.

There are far more informed posters on this site who have made some fabulous arguments for why Benitez shouldnt have been hired and why he is currently doing a poor job.

I listed 20 odd bullet points providing clear examples as well.

The fact that he is a former Liverpool manager is the candle, not the cake, not the icing and not the cherry.

Use the search function to find these clear and concise opposing views to your own.



B: Again, there is no one who would have any credibility here to argue Benitez should be sacked if he was doing a good job.

Being conservative I predicted we would have 24pts after 13 games. We currently have 15pts from 12 matches.

Hes has underperformed in my opinion.

Anyone can argue that Ancelotti had a fantastic run 12months ago to put us on a strong points total where we were chasing the top 4 positions.

No one is comparing them, what we see is that the next 6 games are going to put the club into freefall.

What is this based upon? Benitez' management of the team this season.


C: Again, you can use the search function to understand why Benitez' in game tactics are non-existant. Why his subs appear to be pre-planned etc etc

The key here is that there are a multitude of opposing comments to your own which focus on the use of players and tactics.

Funnily enough, they are logical and are written by Evertonians who have witnessed shambolic performances for many decades. Along with younger supporters who have a grasp of footballing strategy, tactics and how our players have underperformed.



TLDR: Use the search function or read the last 1500 odd pages of arguments, opposing views and reasons why posters are opposed to this manager.

You may actually see that some of us have given him praise where it is due and actually wanted him to succeed.

Even a scarecrow could have performed better.

 

[ToffeeM4n]

Certainly acts like one. Interesting how nobody who says Benitez is a terrible manager, should get sacked, will relegate Everton, has the conviction to back what they are saying. Talk is cheap.

I respect everyone's right to dislike him for his past association. You want him out at all cost, even to the disadvantage of the club, totally understandable. I think he's a good manager and needs time. We agree to disagree like proper well brought up adults. But talking wham all the time trying to justify your hatred by inventing all sorts of "reasons" in order to appear unbiased, smart or logical is boring.

And they have to back what they are saying by giving you a 1k freeroll where you lose only if we get relegated and he's still our manager?
Personally, I don't think we will get involved in the relegation batle, at least not after january and he will stay, but if you are that sure he's not a bad manager, put your money on him not being sacked.

Only a crap manager could be in danger of relegation with the same squad that finished 31 points above the danger zone last season.

 

[Cork Evertonian]

Certainly acts like one. Interesting how nobody who says Benitez is a terrible manager, should get sacked, will relegate Everton, has the conviction to back what they are saying. Talk is cheap.

I respect everyone's right to dislike him for his past association. You want him out at all cost, even to the disadvantage of the club, totally understandable. I think he's a good manager and needs time. We agree to disagree like proper well brought up adults. But talking wham all the time trying to justify your hatred by inventing all sorts of "reasons" in order to appear unbiased, smart or logical is boring.

There's no advantage to the club having him here either. Wednesday 1st of December is d day. There's going to be war if loses the derby. He'll probably do it on purpose tbh.

 

[Misa]

As opposed to 'deliberately' mis-reading posts and stating that peoples opinions are based around playing computer games?

I must be living in another dimension where a poster (thats you) is accusing another of being a child, with the goal of taking the 'moral high ground'.

The forum split certainly has a few 'peculiar' posters supporting a manager who has--in every possible way--taken the team backwards this season.

@ForeverBlue92 for example has admitted that Benitez is (at least) two levels below the previous manager.

@Tubey also doesnt consider Benitez to be a top manager.

Both of these posters make a fair point which is that Everton is in a holding pattern due to 'Profit and Sustainability' regulations. As such, they feel that Benitez should be given leeway during this period to move on dross players and rebuild the squad -- they feel that Benitez is 'good enough' to do this.

Most posters are disagreeing based on their opinions differing from that viewpoint.

To rip apart your points:

A: You have taken the view that posters want Benitez sacked as he was a former Liverpool manager.

This is incorrect for most posters here. This argument has been done to death on this very thread and if you bothered to read the opposing viewpoints you would have some grasp of the arguments.

There are far more informed posters on this site who have made some fabulous arguments for why Benitez shouldnt have been hired and why he is currently doing a poor job.

I listed 20 odd bullet points providing clear examples as well.

The fact that he is a former Liverpool manager is the candle, not the cake, not the icing and not the cherry.

Use the search function to find these clear and concise opposing views to your own.



B: Again, there is no one who would have any credibility here to argue Benitez should be sacked if he was doing a good job.

Being conservative I predicted we would have 24pts after 13 games. We currently have 15pts from 12 matches.

Hes has underperformed in my opinion.

Anyone can argue that Ancelotti had a fantastic run 12months ago to put us on a strong points total where we were chasing the top 4 positions.

No one is comparing them, what we see is that the next 6 games are going to put the club into freefall.

What is this based upon? Benitez' management of the team this season.


C: Again, you can use the search function to understand why Benitez' in game tactics are non-existant. Why his subs appear to be pre-planned etc etc

The key here is that there are a multitude of opposing comments to your own which focus on the use of players and tactics.

Funnily enough, they are logical and are written by Evertonians who have witnessed shambolic performances for many decades. Along with younger supporters who have a grasp of footballing strategy, tactics and how our players have underperformed.



TLDR: Use the search function or read the last 1500 odd pages of arguments, opposing views and reasons why posters are opposed to this manager.

You may actually see that some of us have given him praise where it is due and actually wanted him to succeed.

Even a scarecrow could have performed better.

If you are not one of those that dislike him for his past association and invent stories to justify it then the post wasn't meant for you.

And they have to back what they are saying by giving you a 1k freeroll where you lose only if we get relegated and he's still our manager?
Personally, I don't think we will get involved in the relegation batle, at least not after january and he will stay, but if you are that sure he's not a bad manager, put your money on him not being sacked.

Only a crap manager could be in danger of relegation with the same squad that finished 31 points above the danger zone last season.

I'm not sure he won't be sacked. Of course it is a possibility. However, there are some that are sure that he will be sacked and he won't be here at christmas or something like that. I am doubting they am 100% sure despite what they claim. Also, how is it a free roll when so many claim he is dog poo and will relegate Everton? It's a draw if he gets sacked before the end of the season which I'm not sure. Only payout if he is here at the end plus whether Everton is relegated or not.

There's no advantage to the club having him here either. Wednesday 1st of December is d day. There's going to be war if loses the derby. He'll probably do it on purpose tbh.

I'm not optimistic about the game and it's likely a heavy loss. I am however not giving up on the game and hope for a win. Let's get a win at Brentford first. There's no way he will lose on purpose though.

 

[Misa]

It’s interesting to note how his supporters here claim ‘he’s a professional doing a job and will cast aside past prejudices’ when his actions so far have actually shown far more in common with a man wanting to do an inside job on his arch enemies and get them relegated.

My money is certainly on the latter.

Just to add, I wasn't even the one that started the money thing.

 

[Marius57]

How much are we talking about? I can go up to 1000 pounds as a friendly wager with rules as below:

End of season, he's still the manager of Everton and we get relegated, you win.

End of season, he's still manager of Everton and Everton is not relegated, I win.

If he is sacked before the end of season, regardless of relegation outcome we draw.

I believe this is fair. Deal?

Can't stand it when posters call out other posters by trying to get them to gamble. And acting as if £1000 is a relatively small amount.

You realise that a third of Brits have less that £600 in savings right? And 41% of Brits don't have enough savings to live for a month without income.

You have made some massive assumptions because of a misguided view that he doesn't have conviction behind what he says. Why should anyway have to put their money behind what they say on a forum to have conviction?

If you are so certain about what you think will happen, why don't you go to a betting company and put your £1000 on with them?

 

[Zatara]

Man United 'have Sporting Lisbon boss Ruben Amorim on their radar'

Ralf Rangnick has signed a six-month deal to take over as the interim manager at United, but the club are still on the hunt to find a permanent solution - and Amorim has his admirers.

www.dailymail.co.uk

One of my picks for next boss is now linked with United.

Saying Amorim has a £25mil release clause.

For less than the cost of one Iwobi we could have the best young manager in Europe.

 

[Ladda]

Why did we bring in a washed up manager who's clearly here for the pay cheque? Crystal Palace could have done the same, but they chose to go with a high risk/high reward manager that's paying off for them. Villa is another one. We always seem to go with someone "safe".

 

[Kev The Rat]

How much are we talking about? I can go up to 1000 pounds as a friendly wager with rules as below:

End of season, he's still the manager of Everton and we get relegated, you win.

End of season, he's still manager of Everton and Everton is not relegated, I win.

If he is sacked before the end of season, regardless of relegation outcome we draw.

I believe this is fair. Deal?

I realise English isn’t your first language, but in this country we have certain linguistic concepts - one of which is ‘figure of speech’ and another called ‘irony’.

For example when someone says ‘my money is on xxx’ it doesn’t necessarily mean they’ve actually gone and placed a physical bet anywhere, it can just be a device to demonstrate an opinion that something will or is happening.

 

[Yarrgh]

Knife Sharpening.

Be ready for Wednesday night.

Hope I won't need it.

 

[cipher]

Imagine thinking a result on Wednesday should have an impact on whether he stays or goes. The top three teams are in the top 5-7 in the world, miles ahead of everyone in this league, and we're nowhere near them at this point in time. As others have said, the games that matter are Brentford and Arsenal. If we get any points from Liverpool, City or Chelsea this year than that is a bonus. That said, if we consistently see poor results against the REST of the league then this discussion starts to have merit. To think one game against Liverpool would be the back breaker, given both teams current respective standings, is comical.

 

[roy vernon]

Put personal feelings to one side.

Benitez is supposedly very meticulous and would go through every aspect of the football operation and be ruthless -- thats what we need.

Brands doesnt seem to have the personality to push for change -- Benitez definitely does.

I feel that he would totally gut our footballing operation and modernise and improve it.

Just look at what he was doing in China, its quite impressive.

Definitely have him as a DOF.

The Problem is Zat, a DOF, if used correctly, is supposed to be in charge of appointments and transfers and is supposed to instill an integrated playing style right through the club, from youth team up.

From what I have seen of Benitez’ football I really wouldn’t want to see him instilling his football style throughout the club. The plucky sit deep and hoof it to the forwards, kick and rush Everton. No thanks.

 

[Zatara]

The Problem is Zat, a DOF, if used correctly, is supposed to be in charge of appointments and transfers and is supposed to instill an integrated playing style right through the club, from youth team up.

From what I have seen of Benitez’ football I really wouldn’t want to see him instilling his football style throughout the club. The plucky sit deep and hoof it to the forwards, kick and rush Everton. No thanks.

Yes, fair enough i agree.

We could do with a Benitez to dismantle everything and rebuild the structure of the club APART from the actual transfers and playing style

 

[PhilM]

Why did we bring in a washed up manager who's clearly here for the pay cheque? Crystal Palace could have done the same, but they chose to go with a high risk/high reward manager that's paying off for them. Villa is another one. We always seem to go with someone "safe".

While not disagreeing with Vieira's success (up to now), he was one of the favourites to be sacked as people questioned whether he was up to the job.

I think that risk will have been the key factor in the decision.