Paulo Fonseca

[davek]

Both are past their best and need to be moved on/aside.

...and are disruptive.

 

[Jebus_lives]

We need a massive clear out.

To me, it makes no sense hiring managers when that lot are in place. It's like trying to build a house on a swamp.

Premier league thrives on pace/movement. Baines was a good player once, but he doesn't have the pace anymore to cut it. We need a long term replacement. Jagielka is well past his best and realistically cannot be our starting CB next season.

 

[Paul E]

He and Jagielka are poison. If those two are shown the door we have half a chance of building something. If one or both remain next season then we are in the gutter again.

Baines isn't the player he once was and Jagielka should never have been captain but poison, really?
Explain why.

 

[rockin' robin]

I'm no Everton fan because I'm against a player who has no discipline and has briefed the media against the manager/team in the past, and who now has nothing to offer so I wont be sentimental about his pretty mediocre waning talent?

Ok.

Yes Baines is past his best, but he’s been a wonderful servant of Everton. To dismiss him the way you did shows up your pettiness and lack of respect. Like some of your posts, I know you play devils advicate a lot, but you make some good points. But I increasingly fear that you are a davek fan. Not an Everton fan at all.

 

[Efcjake]

ONE
OF
US

Je suis Leighton.

 

[davek]

Baines isn't the player he once was and Jagielka should never have been captain but poison, really?
Explain why.

They have previous in creating and/or deepening a crisis, certainly Baines has. These two have been central as senior players in this team for years. As said earlier above the word I've been given is that there is a clique in that squad of senior players who are an alternate source of power to management.

 

[blueblue]

Tbf to Samosaurus, that atmosphere is one any incoming manager will struggle with unless they ruthlessly deal with it this summer.

At a minimum that means slinging out the likes of Baines, Jagielka, Williams, Schneiderlin and Rooney.

Get shut of that lot and the FF dynamic is changed for good. Dont get shut and we'll be seeing more managers than Crystal Palace do.

I think Dave that what you are in danger of doing is getting rid of the leaders in the squad... that would be a disaster.
It is how these leaders are managed that is crucial and it if the manager cannot do that then they are not fit for the job.

A manager being undermined by players says more about the manager than the players.

 

[Boss_Rarkley]

I think Dave that what you are in danger of doing is getting rid of the leaders in the squad... that would be a disaster.
It is how these leaders are managed that is crucial and it if the manager cannot do that then they are not fit for the job.

A manager being undermined by players says more about the manager than the players.

If those 5 are our leaders then we are in trouble.

 

[davek]

I think Dave that what you are in danger of doing is getting rid of the leaders in the squad... that would be a disaster.
It is how these leaders are managed that is crucial and it if the manager cannot do that then they are not fit for the job.

A manager being undermined by players says more about the manager than the players.

Players at the end of their careers wont be disciplined. There is nothing to lose. They have built up power bases in the squad and are a threat to any manager they dont take to.

There's one way of dealing with that: get shut of them. Allow no alternate power base. Baines and Jagielka contribute nothing essential to this club. It'd be a piece of piss to punt them.

 

[davek]

If those 5 are our leaders then we are in trouble.

This.

We are sunk next season if they are still here stinking the gaff out.

 

[Loadsofchemistry]

They have previous in creating and/or deepening a crisis, certainly Baines has. These two have been central as senior players in this team for years. As said earlier above the word I've been given is that there is a clique in that squad of senior players who are an alternate source of power to management.

I’ve said for a while now, the players have downed tools for 3 different managers.at best. baines and jags have been weak-as senior squad members enough to let it happen at worst they have led the 3 different dressing rooms in to a revolt.

 

[blueblue]

If we are to be a top club then we need top players.
Top players are opinionated, egotistical leaders and you cannot have enough of them in a team.

Unfortunately or fortunately they are difficult to manage and require top managers to do so. Roberto Martinez in particular although a really nice man simply does not have the ability to manage on a daily basis top level players.
His ability at international level will be seen by us all shortly.

I have always felt that RM would be absolutely wonderful at being in charge of all our academy.

 

[blueblue]

Players at the end of their careers wont be disciplined. There is nothing to lose. They have built up power bases in the squad and are a threat to any manager they dont take to.

There's one way of dealing with that: get shut of them. Allow no alternate power base. Baines and Jagielka contribute nothing essential to this club. It'd be a piece of piss to punt them.

They are at the end of their careers now but were at their peak when they got rid of RM.

I don't remember saying that they are our best players, I think I said they are leaders.

If people cannot see the difference between being the best player and being a leader then I can't help that.

 

[blueblue]

Players at the end of their careers wont be disciplined. There is nothing to lose. They have built up power bases in the squad and are a threat to any manager they dont take to.

There's one way of dealing with that: get shut of them. Allow no alternate power base. Baines and Jagielka contribute nothing essential to this club. It'd be a piece of piss to punt them.

A strong manager will have control over his players.
Sam for all his faults is a strong manager and we all saw how he dealt with the Rooney incident last weekend during and after the event... even though everybody knows he may be gone in a few weeks.

 

[Jimishorts]

We need a massive clear out.

To me, it makes no sense hiring managers when that lot are in place. It's like trying to build a house on a swamp.

Or a stadium on a wet dock.