Munich Shooting

[jaycee]

Theres a very very small percentage of Muslims,responsible for recent attacks,but that has to be acknoeledged that it is a religious terror group,without admitting it you cant begin to find a solution to it

 

[SNova]

I think some people would change their tune if it were their own family being murdered. Or suffering rape, sexual assault and increased crime.

 

[Walken]

I think some people would change their tune if it were their own family being murdered. Or suffering rape, sexual assault and increased crime.

yes lets hope all decision makers have some personal bias on the situation to help them make the right choices, you are a genius

 

[Steve0]

Seriously though, at what point does one say enough is enough? Surely even the most liberal minded apologist is getting a little bit fed up by now?

 

[dholliday]

the part were you said all muslims think differently to all non-muslims, and arrogantly quoted your own experiences as the definitive ones, I've been all over the world and that has not been my experience, just spent a couple of months in Indonesia, can't say I felt they thought differently to other human beings as you do

Fair enough, mate. In my view (and experience) Muslims think differently to non-believers because they actually believe in fairy stories. This, as neuroscience has shown, actively alters certain pathways in the brain. They do indeed think differently.

So do Christians. But Christians have had a really important cultural revolution which favoured freedom, equal rights and science, while still retaining the faith. Islam (and the world) desperately needs similar.

Sometimes Carlos, it's better to be horrible to prevent something horrible happening, than do nothing but wring your hands.

I don't agree, as fighting fire with fire causes only more fire...as we've seen enough times.

The only solution at this late stage is for Islam to have its secular revolution. If this doesn't happen, then I don't see things getting much better. The way Turkey's going (the fabled most liberal Muslim country in the world), there is reason to be pessimistic.

 

[Walken]

Seriously though, at what point does one say enough is enough? Surely even the most liberal minded apologist is getting a little bit fed up by now?

who is defending the killings, no one

 

[longers]

I think some people would change their tune if it were their own family being murdered. Or suffering rape, sexual assault and increased crime.

Why ? id despise the people who did it but it's not going to make me suddenly start making ridiculous generalizations about a demographic of 1.6 billion people.

Id hate the people who did it and continue to have great relationships with my muslim mates and co workers.

 

[Walken]

Fair enough, mate. In my view (and experience) Muslims think differently to non-believers because they actually believe in fairy stories. This, as neuroscience has shown, actively alters certain pathways in the brain. They do indeed think differently.

So do Christians. But Christians have had a really important cultural revolution which favoured freedom, equal rights and science, while still retaining the faith. Islam (and the world) desperately needs similar.




I don't agree, as fighting fire with fire causes only more fire...as we've seen enough times.

The only solution at this late stage is for Islam to have its secular revolution. If this doesn't happen, then I don't see things getting much better. The way Turkey's going (the fabled most liberal Muslim country in the world), there is reason to be pessimistic.

Well you at least need to recognise how broad of a stroke you paint when you say 'all muslims', it's an absolutely ludicrous assertion to make, if you want to talk about solutions and as you put it the elephant in the room, you are well capable of doing so without stooping to such levels

 

[Steve0]

Their actions are given a protected status by their religion. Just imagine if these acts were carried out by a far right nationalist organisation.

I know the analogy isn't perfect but the calls for their immediate banning and imprisoning of all their members would be universal. Anyone attempting to deflect blame by saying 'but most BNP members DONT KILL and they GIVE TO CHARITY' would be looked on with contempt.

We need muslims to step up and really condemn these people. Root out the radicalists. Demonise them. Don't get theme elected to positions of power. Don't allow them to preach in mosques. Don't allow them to sully your name with their nefarious street stalls.

 

[nsno-chris]

He's referring to Muslims and non-Muslims. Muslims are, by their own definition, quite different to non-Muslims. I had close experience with them and can confirm they do indeed think quite differently.

That's a massive stretch mate; theres a massive difference between Extreme Muslims and Muslims, non-Muslims. But the same is to applied to other religions as well. There is always a fanatical side to everything, some follow the religious books and others implement them word for word.

 

[Whistlin' Dixie]

who is defending the killings, no one

Except the fundamentalist loons....who go to the same mosques & bazaars as the 'moderates'.

 

[dholliday]

In the end it'll be up to the voters of Belgium, France and Germany to show how they regard the state of play.

Anyone with views similar to mine back in September were labled "far-right" and "hate-filled Nazis". It's a horrible response to genuine concerns.

The result might be the moderate AfD (who are being bashed in the media as far-right) getting into a coalition with CDU. I would support this.

As with Brexit, the people are giving their governments and media a wake-up call. Le Pen and AfD getting in would be on that level.

Oh for this to be so rational. Instead it's more akin to saying because we had 100 deaths per day, we're going to ban all cars and press for criminal charges against Merkel for allowing cars on the road.

No, it's nothing like that at all. Or are you trying to say I support the deportation of all Muslims living in Europe? If you are, then I take back my comment that you're a sound debater.

 

[Steve0]

who is defending the killings, no one

Not defending the killings as that would be impossible but people are shaming anyone who wants stronger action by labelling them as racist.

Not the same thing but in the same ball park.

 

[Walken]

Except the fundamentalist loons....who go to the same mosques & bazaars as the 'moderates'.

you know full well who the term apologist was being aimed at, and it wasn't anyone who frequents a mosque

 

[SNova]

yes lets hope all decision makers have some personal bias on the situation to help them make the right choices, you are a genius

Yeah it's alright for Merkel in her gated community. She'll never suffer the consequences of her pathological altruism.

Those of us who warned of the dangers from the start were called all the names under the sun by the so called tolerant. Unfortunately our concerns have now shown to be correct.