Kevin Feely

[Seamus Colemole]

So if "youth" get played if they are good enough, where does the "Everton give youth a chance" myth come from?

Because youth at any team in the world will get played if they are good enough.

Its the ones with potential, who have ability but need help to develop into squad players that need to be given the chance.

But they aren't.

And chance doesn't mean playing week in week out in front of better established players, but getting mins here and there, starts against weaker teams etc etc. Not sitting on the bench at best.

Tony Hibbert and Victor Anichebe got given the chance. Like them or not they are useful meambers in a squad of a cash strapped prem team. But if they weren't given that chance they'd be playing in league 1 right now and used as "proof" that it was right not to give them a chance.

The next Messi isn't wasting away in our reserves. But the next free squad players are. If they get that chance they could fail completly, they could show enough to be a useful squad player or it could help their development and give them that push on to become first team players.

But they don't even get that chance. Until we have no other players available due to injury.

 

[Kurt.]

Since January we have lost about 3 or 4 league games, reached a cup semi final ( ok we all know what happened there ), finished in respectable place in the table, strengthened our squad over the summer with some quality, beat united in our opening game of this season yet we still feckin moan and moan and feckin moan some more.................I love being an Evertonian ffs !!

 

[Goat]

So if "youth" get played if they are good enough, where does the "Everton give youth a chance" myth come from?

Because youth at any team in the world will get played if they are good enough.

Its the ones with potential, who have ability but need help to develop into squad players that need to be given the chance.

But they aren't.

And chance doesn't mean playing week in week out in front of better established players, but getting mins here and there, starts against weaker teams etc etc. Not sitting on the bench at best.

Tony Hibbert and Victor Anichebe got given the chance. Like them or not they are useful meambers in a squad of a cash strapped prem team. But if they weren't given that chance they'd be playing in league 1 right now and used as "proof" that it was right not to give them a chance.

The next Messi isn't wasting away in our reserves. But the next free squad players are. If they get that chance they could fail completly, they could show enough to be a useful squad player or it could help their development and give them that push on to become first team players.

But they don't even get that chance. Until we have no other players available due to injury.

Isnt that the point of a youth player tho, to sit and wait for his chance and take it when it comes.

Ross Barkley got his chance, against Leyton Orient, he stank Goodison out.

 

[formerly manx toffee]

Duffy has 3 superb CBs ahead of him, hence him not getting games.
Barkley is highly rated? By who? Martin Keown?

The belief that Everton has a superb youth system is so wrong its insane.

The last great hope is currently sitting by the phone at his mars house waiting for it to ring.
The 1 before him is currently ripping up League One.
The 1 before him is playing for the League Champions.
The 1 before him is playing for United.

Joao Silva, Magaye Guaye, Apostolos Vellios, Shkodran Mustafi, Anton Peterlin, Luke Garbutt, Mathew Kennedy, Seamus Coleman, Francisco Junior have all been bought in the last few Years, for less than 3m, none of them have had much playing time.

Why is that? Could it be that they are young players learning the game and have experienced players ahead of them?

Or is it simply that they are a bit poopoo.

Youth gets a chance at Everton, when the Youth is Wayne Rooney or Jack Rodwell.

I don't mind that list though. Buying youth or developing it is no guarantee of them being successful, but if your academy and reserves can pay for themselves by turning over a few million here and there and find a few gems then all well and good. Buy a few more for me, perhaps we should have taken a chance on McClean when we were interested, but you don't get them all right.

 

[Seamus Colemole]

Isnt that the point of a youth player tho, to sit and wait for his chance and take it when it comes.

Ross Barkley got his chance, against Leyton Orient, he stank Goodison out.

Barkley was the best player on the pitch against QPR. Didn't see the Orient game but i'll take your word for it : he stank.

Duffy done well when he played those 3 games last season. Played against Blackpool pre season and was poor.

In Tony Hibberts first 2 full seasons he made 10 and 24 appearances. In Victor Anichebes first 2 seasons he made 19 and 27.

They got a chance.

Sure, i know its not that simple but the point still remains : they both got given a proper actual chance in the team and became useful squad members.

Those chances are not being given to players at Everton these days.

If Everton were the team who gave youth a chance some of our younger players who are in the reserves now and have left in previous years would have been given the same chance, or even half the chance.

If they were Rooney or Rodwell quality they'd be sold to League Champions. If they were Hibbert or Anichebe quality theyd either be squad members or making a living in League 1.

But none of them have actually got the chance.

 

[Goat]

Tony Hibbert made his debut in 2001.
Victor Anichebe in 2006.

Im sure you will agree that the 2012 Everton squad craps all over both of those squads.

Hence young players of, lets say, "lesser quality" got more chances.

Nobody wants to see Barkley on the pitch more than me, but the lad is 18 Years of age FFS.

He will get his chance and its up to him to grab it with both hands, like, as you say, he did against QPR.

 

[RFUS]

Tony Hibbert made his debut in 2001.
Victor Anichebe in 2006.

Im sure you will agree that the 2012 Everton squad craps all over both of those squads.

Hence young players of, lets say, "lesser quality" got more chances.

Nobody wants to see Barkley on the pitch more than me, but the lad is 18 Years of age FFS.

He will get his chance and its up to him to grab it with both hands, like, as you say, he did against QPR.

When you're young though you need chances, not the odd singular chance. You will make mistakes and an arm around the shoulder is needed. He was ace against QPR and then gave away a pen against Blackburn and was subbed and well, that put an end to him starting games.

I'm not saying he should be the core of our team for 90 minutes every week, but I just don't think he's been given nearly enough time. He played the minutes equivalent of 2 1/2 premier league games last year.

 

[Seamus Colemole]

Tony Hibbert made his debut in 2001.
Victor Anichebe in 2006.

Im sure you will agree that the 2012 Everton squad craps all over both of those squads.

Hence young players of, lets say, "lesser quality" got more chances.

Nobody wants to see Barkley on the pitch more than me, but the lad is 18 Years of age FFS.

He will get his chance and its up to him to grab it with both hands, like, as you say, he did against QPR.

Yeah sure our squad now is better than it was then. So surely we can risk playing a young player a bit more easily now, with the other 10 players being better quality than the 10 players around Hibbert and Anichebe?

And its not just Barkley at all, its all the other youth players we've had since.

They pretty much never got a chance, thats what the issue is. The new Messi or the new Barlow, they never even got the chance.

 

[Allezfan]

Buying young kids playing frst team football in a subpar league for a pittance and then mostly either selling them (silva, peterlin), playing them as squad members but nor first choice (gueye, vellios, coleman, duffy) or playing them in a handful of games then moving them on (gosling, mustafi, ruddy, jukebox, that icelandic lid) has been our policy for about six years.

It's one I approve of. And that's regardless of whether or not Moyes give youth a chance.

 

[Goat]

When you're young though you need chances, not the odd singular chance. You will make mistakes and an arm around the shoulder is needed. He was ace against QPR and then gave away a pen against Blackburn and was subbed and well, that put an end to him starting games.

I'm not saying he should be the core of our team for 90 minutes every week, but I just don't think he's been given nearly enough time. He played the minutes equivalent of 2 1/2 premier league games last year.

Yeah, ive said in the past, the lad should be playing more, a LOT more, but he sill only is 18.

And I think we need to realise, Moyes seriously doesnt rate the lad.

 

[RFUS]

Yeah, ive said in the past, the lad should be playing more, a LOT more, but he sill only is 18.

And I think we need to realise, Moyes seriously doesnt rate the lad.

I'm not sure I believe that. He surely sees his quality.

Do you mean he doesn't rate him in terms of his level now, and more specifically his defensive ability? I'd believe that.

But Barkley isn't another Baxter.

 

[Goat]

Yeah sure our squad now is better than it was then. So surely we can risk playing a young player a bit more easily now, with the other 10 players being better quality than the 10 players around Hibbert and Anichebe?

And its not just Barkley at all, its all the other youth players we've had since.

They pretty much never got a chance, thats what the issue is. The new Messi or the new Barlow, they never even got the chance.

And so far, Moyes has been correct.

ITs not as if ANYBODY has yet to leave Everton as a youngster and gone on to be anything.

 

[Goat]

I'm not sure I believe that. He surely sees his quality.

Do you mean he doesn't rate him in terms of his level now, and more specifically his defensive ability? I'd believe that.

But Barkley isn't another Baxter.

He doesnt rate him NOW.

He must surely see the potential.

 

[Allezfan]

And so far, Moyes has been correct.

ITs not as if ANYBODY has yet to leave Everton as a youngster and gone on to be anything.

It's a chicken or egg thing, though. Do they get dumped into the reserves because they're **** or are they **** because they're not getting coached right?

 

[RFUS]

And so far, Moyes has been correct.

ITs not as if ANYBODY has yet to leave Everton as a youngster and gone on to be anything.

Well in terms of those released/sold to smaller clubs, maybe not. Although Baines and Jags were both let go... that's kind of embarrassing! I have no idea if that was before Moyes' time though.