Increasing debate on Rom.

[ijjysmith]

The one thing i am shocked at is the fact we talk about strikers and how we can improve the team with passing, aggression and such like, the worrying thing for me is that nobody has mentioned playing two up front. In recent memory i can only remember AJ, Beattie, yakubu, bent and Jelavic being used as one upfront. It would be interesting to see us play two strikers, could this help ease the pressure on Rom ?

Can the mods link this to the traffic kone thread, start a petition for a Kone & Lukaku strike force ? We will do the following:

1. Kone & Romelu petition.
2. Stadium construction.
3. Get @ijjysmith some anger management.

I'm always so angry.

 

[Little Ralphy]

I get your point in the WC and Toe injury. The worst thing is he was poor-average for belgium, origi played instead of him because they realised Lukaku wasnt cutting it.

I think that's a bit harsh on Rom regarding the WC to be fair. Origi only looked half decent when he came on to replace Lukaku, after Lukaku had pushed around their defence and everyone was getting tired. Fresh pacey legs and Origi looked ok. When Origi started games he looked poor and it was Lukaku who benefited then against the United States doing exactly the same, running at tiring defenders.

Belgium struggled at the WC because players like Hazard didn't show up. They had a largely inexperienced side at that level and it showed, so I think it's unfair to single out Lukaku as being poor-average when the whole side struggled to get anything going, and were largely just hard to beat benefiting from a favourable draw.

Strikers only tend to be as good as their service, if you don't create anything for them then you can't expect an awful lot.

 

[tim cahill]

I think that's a bit harsh on Rom regarding the WC to be fair. Origi only looked half decent when he came on to replace Lukaku, after Lukaku had pushed around their defence and everyone was getting tired. Fresh pacey legs and Origi looked ok. When Origi started games he looked poor and it was Lukaku who benefited then against the United States doing exactly the same, running at tiring defenders.

Belgium struggled at the WC because players like Hazard didn't show up. They had a largely inexperienced side at that level and it showed, so I think it's unfair to single out Lukaku as being poor-average when the whole side struggled to get anything going, and were largely just hard to beat benefiting from a favourable draw.

Strikers only tend to be as good as their service, if you don't create anything for them then you can't expect an awful lot.

I'm not totally convinced by that argument. It's true up to a point obviously but a good striker will get into positions to score more than a lesser striker. At present I don't think Lukaku's movement in the box isn't good enough and this is vital if he's going to step up to being a top top player. Naismith finds space in the box much better than Rom at present. For example, If you watch Jags goal at the weekend you can see Rom is fairly static while Naismith is constantly moving and was ready to pounce if the shot hadn't gone in.

 

[davek]

Martinez has got the Lukaku situation arse about face. He's basically reshuffling the whole front line in order to accommodate a player (Naismith) who's neither an acm or line leading striker. He's got Lukaku doing the donkey work out wide for him or else being used to hold the ball up for him to go beyond the last defender. Lukaku is a £28M player bought to get goals. Martinez is not using him as the spearhead of an attack that he should be used as. In short: we wont see the best of Lukaku until Barkley is back and gives us that familiar shape we had last season.

With all the problems in defence the forward play this season has gone under the radar a bit. But it's been a dogs breakfast of a mess. It's painful to watch Lukaku struggling through this. Martinez never got crucial back up players this summer (acm/playmaker being one of them). Barkley's injury killed us on the eve of the season and we need him back to stabilise.

 

[Prevenger17]

Martinez has got the Lukaku situation arse about face. He's basically reshuffling the whole front line in order to accommodate a player (Naismith) who's neither an acm or line leading striker. He's got Lukaku doing the donkey work out wide for him or else being used to hold the ball up for him to go beyond the last defender. Lukaku is a £28M player bought to get goals. Martinez is not using him as the spearhead of an attack that he should be used as. In short: we wont see the best of Lukaku until Barkley is back and gives us that familiar shape we had last season.

With all the problems in defence the forward play this season has gone under the radar a bit. But it's been a dogs breakfast of a mess. It's painful to watch Lukaku struggling through this. Martinez never got crucial back up players this summer (acm/playmaker being one of them). Barkley's injury killed us on the eve of the season and we need him back to stabilise.

 

[Little Ralphy]

I'm not totally convinced by that argument. It's true up to a point obviously but a good striker will get into positions to score more than a lesser striker. At present I don't think Lukaku's movement in the box isn't good enough and this is vital if he's going to step up to being a top top player. Naismith finds space in the box much better than Rom at present. For example, If you watch Jags goal at the weekend you can see Rom is fairly static while Naismith is constantly moving and was ready to pounce if the shot hadn't gone in.

Lukaku is the kind of striker who attacks the ball, Naismith is the kind of player who tries to get on the end of loose balls. There is a world of difference between the two. Naismith has to be this kind of player because he doesn't have any physical attributes to do much else. Lukaku I agree could add a bit of that to his game, but if you watch Lukaku he makes some good runs early in the play. As a team Everton can be too slow in the build up and the space that Lukaku had worked for has gone half the time or the ball doesn't come.

It's all about adapting, but Lukaku still scored a lot of goals last season playing centrally in this side, and given we spent £28m on him and he is perhaps the most promising striker of that age in World football, I think it's criminal that Martinez isn't trying to play to his strengths. Get the ball in to the box for him to attack and he'll be a real handful.

 

[tim cahill]

Lukaku is the kind of striker who attacks the ball, Naismith is the kind of player who tries to get on the end of loose balls. There is a world of difference between the two. Naismith has to be this kind of player because he doesn't have any physical attributes to do much else. Lukaku I agree could add a bit of that to his game, but if you watch Lukaku he makes some good runs early in the play. As a team Everton can be too slow in the build up and the space that Lukaku had worked for has gone half the time or the ball doesn't come.

It's all about adapting, but Lukaku still scored a lot of goals last season playing centrally in this side, and given we spent £28m on him and he is perhaps the most promising striker of that age in World football, I think it's criminal that Martinez isn't trying to play to his strengths. Get the ball in to the box for him to attack and he'll be a real handful.

A striker who attacks the ball?? What does that even mean?
He's a great finisher, he's got great physical attributes and he's young which is why we've paid so much for him but his weaknesses are clear at the moment: his hold up play, his first touch and his movement in the box could all improve, there's no doubt about that. I just think the idea that his lack of goals this season is everyone else's fault but Lukaku's is wrong. We've scored a lot of goals this season so chances are there, he's just not the one in the position to finish many of them.

 

[1966efc]

Lukaku is the kind of striker who attacks the ball, Naismith is the kind of player who tries to get on the end of loose balls. There is a world of difference between the two. Naismith has to be this kind of player because he doesn't have any physical attributes to do much else. Lukaku I agree could add a bit of that to his game, but if you watch Lukaku he makes some good runs early in the play. As a team Everton can be too slow in the build up and the space that Lukaku had worked for has gone half the time or the ball doesn't come.

It's all about adapting, but Lukaku still scored a lot of goals last season playing centrally in this side, and given we spent £28m on him and he is perhaps the most promising striker of that age in World football, I think it's criminal that Martinez isn't trying to play to his strengths. Get the ball in to the box for him to attack and he'll be a real handful.

Yeah, but, as someone has pointed out, if you haven't got the likes of Coleman and Pienaar, and Baines isn't blowing on all four cylinders, who is going to provide the kind of service he thrives on? You can blame fate but you can't blame Martinez. At the moment, he has crap cards and he's just trying to make the best hand he can out of them I M O.

 

[Bill_Murray_Movies]

I genuinely don't understand the work rate debate in regards to Lukaku. Maybe David Moyes somehow managed to convince our fans that strikers are supposed to close down defenders full throttle all game as if some 10 year old is controlling them via a Playstation pad in the Gwladys and won't stop holding down the sprint button.

David Moyes had a tremendous record of bringing in goalscorers and then burning them out via 'hard work' and 'work rate'. They would spend so much time chasing loose ends and harrying full backs that the majority of them forgot how to score. Andrew Johnson scored 17 goals in 61 Premier League games for Everton but the sight of him chasing a ball in to the corner flag would get fans so hard they didn't care. James Beattie scored 13 goals in 76 Premier League appearances but remember when he worked so hard he would butt players? I guess Moyes cannot be blamed for Saha as he was already a crock by the time he arrived but I imagine playing upfront on his own for 3 years certainly didn't help his already fragile body. His mad methods even stopped Fat Yak from netting. In his last 3 years at the club he went 10 in 53.

It seems to be the general consensus of Everton fans that Lukaku is lazy. I couldn't disagree more. I think it's an easy shout for the ignorant masses to blur when they're at the game and want to look involved.

I'm personally very pleased with our £28m investment. He's quick, strong, got a great finish, and best of all; he's an intelligent footballer. His back to goal play is far superior to what Everton fans would have you believe too. If you've ever played 11 a side football at any level you know it's invaluable to have a striker who knows when to play the way he is facing and when to be more direct. He's just a beast. A proper boss footballer.

 

[davek]

Martinez has to be strong and face this cult down.

 

[Dell Boy]

Can some of you please stop being utter bells.

We're only just into the start of the season. Some on here are running around like demented Kopites.

Lukaku is going to be world class. Relax.

 

[tim cahill]

Can some of you please stop being utter bells.

We're only just into the start of the season. Some on here are running around like demented Kopites.

Lukaku is going to be world class. Relax.

He's got a lot to improve on before he's close to being world class mate.

 

[Prevenger17]

Martinez has to be strong and face this cult down.

There's too many of us now. We're serving you lunch at the local deli, delivering your milk morning and driving your kids to school. Accept Naismith into your heart Dave, the blonde wig and glowing red eyes are complimentary and you also get a neat mug for a limited time only.

 

[tim cahill]

I genuinely don't understand the work rate debate in regards to Lukaku. Maybe David Moyes somehow managed to convince our fans that strikers are supposed to close down defenders full throttle all game as if some 10 year old is controlling them via a Playstation pad in the Gwladys and won't stop holding down the sprint button.

David Moyes had a tremendous record of bringing in goalscorers and then burning them out via 'hard work' and 'work rate'. They would spend so much time chasing loose ends and harrying full backs that the majority of them forgot how to score. Andrew Johnson scored 17 goals in 61 Premier League games for Everton but the sight of him chasing a ball in to the corner flag would get fans so hard they didn't care. James Beattie scored 13 goals in 76 Premier League appearances but remember when he worked so hard he would butt players? I guess Moyes cannot be blamed for Saha as he was already a crock by the time he arrived but I imagine playing upfront on his own for 3 years certainly didn't help his already fragile body. His mad methods even stopped Fat Yak from netting. In his last 3 years at the club he went 10 in 53.

It seems to be the general consensus of Everton fans that Lukaku is lazy. I couldn't disagree more. I think it's an easy shout for the ignorant masses to blur when they're at the game and want to look involved.

I'm personally very pleased with our £28m investment. He's quick, strong, got a great finish, and best of all; he's an intelligent footballer. His back to goal play is far superior to what Everton fans would have you believe too. If you've ever played 11 a side football at any level you know it's invaluable to have a striker who knows when to play the way he is facing and when to be more direct. He's just a beast. A proper boss footballer.

I disagree. He loses the ball too often when it's played up to him.

 

[Dell Boy]

He's got a lot to improve on before he's close to being world class mate.

Read the words melon. He's going to be world class. Going to be.