Everton's loan haven is attracting other clubs, says Roberto Martínez

[nigelcoyb]

Seriously, if this wasn't such a stupid comment, it'd be hilarious.

If you can't grasp the fact, that due to the success of Martinez treatment of 2 future World stars of the game, that we're now viewed as a preferred destination for up & coming talent from all over Europe, is a massive positive for the club, then you need to go lock yourself away with your 80's programmes & give the game up man.

The loan system is used by most clubs these days, it's the way the game has developed. Even across the park with their far bigger budgets, they've got 2 high profile loan players. So the fact that we've got ourselves into a position where we can gain maximum value from this channel, is a massive boost for the club.

Absolutely spot on.

 

[The Hibbert Agenda]

It's no good trying to make a virtue out of a necessity. It's something we have to do (and we have a manager who can be flexible and operate that way), but it's a recipe for treading water.

We have people in control of the club who are letting us down badly. Regardless of the obvious fact that they have not (and will not) put a penny into the club themselves, there is huge amounts of cash coming into Everton from tv revenue and player sales, but the manager is not getting the benefit. It's either diverted into some arcane costing on the accounts or simply credited to paying down debts that never seem to get any smaller year on year.

This loan strategy just underlines how poorly run and off the pace we are as an organisation.

Its no good trying to make a travesty out of a virtue either

every single thread. its quite impressive. does smiling hurt too?

 

[davek]

Seriously, if this wasn't such a stupid comment, it'd be hilarious.

If you can't grasp the fact, that due to the success of Martinez treatment of 2 future World stars of the game, that we're now viewed as a preferred destination for up & coming talent from all over Europe, is a massive positive for the club, then you need to go lock yourself away with your 80's programmes & give the game up man.

The loan system is used by most clubs these days, it's the way the game has developed. Even across the park with their far bigger budgets, they've got 2 high profile loan players. So the fact that we've got ourselves into a position where we can gain maximum value from this channel, is a massive boost for the club.

In their case it's to deepen the squad. They'll be by no means first teamers week in week out that they'll be struggling to cope without next season.

Liverpool are in a completely different boat to us. They can keep star players and play the loan market at luxury. We, on the other hand, are going to be highly dependent on loan players. We're far less stable as a consequence.

 

[davek]

Its no good trying to make a travesty out of a virtue either

every single thread. its quite impressive. does smiling hurt too?

I dont even know what that means.

 

[teppic]

It's no good trying to make a virtue out of a necessity. It's something we have to do (and we have a manager who can be flexible and operate that way), but it's a recipe for treading water.

We have people in control of the club who are letting us down badly. Regardless of the obvious fact that they have not (and will not) put a penny into the club themselves, there is huge amounts of cash coming into Everton from tv revenue and player sales, but the manager is not getting the benefit. It's either diverted into some arcane costing on the accounts or simply credited to paying down debts that never seem to get any smaller year on year.

This loan strategy just underlines how poorly run and off the pace we are as an organisation.

It will be very interesting if we qualify for the Champions League, if the board still cry poverty at every transfer window. To have had this debt for so long in the world's richest league, coupled with a negative net spend on players over the last 10 years, is simply astonishing.

 

[Foot Long Hot Dog]

It's no good trying to make a virtue out of a necessity. It's something we have to do (and we have a manager who can be flexible and operate that way), but it's a recipe for treading water.

We have people in control of the club who are letting us down badly. Regardless of the obvious fact that they have not (and will not) put a penny into the club themselves, there is huge amounts of cash coming into Everton from tv revenue and player sales, but the manager is not getting the benefit. It's either diverted into some arcane costing on the accounts or simply credited to paying down debts that never seem to get any smaller year on year.

This loan strategy just underlines how poorly run and off the pace we are as an organisation.

It's no good trying to take a positive & twist it into a negative that suits your agenda either Dave.

The fact that Martinez has gained maximum impact from the loan market is a positive - the end.

You wanting to highlight that it doesn't excuse the lack of player investment from the club, is one thing - seeking to turn it into some form of negative all round is truly sad.

 

[davek]

It will be very interesting if we qualify for the Champions League, if the board still cry poverty at every transfer window. To have had this debt for so long in the world's richest league, coupled with a negative net spend on players over the last 10 years, is simply astonishing.

Well, we all know they **** themselves the last time we qualified in 4th. Kroldrup the big signing at 5M to boost the *push* for qualification to the group stages.

 

[davek]

It's no good trying to take a positive & twist it into a negative that suits your agenda either Dave.

The fact that Martinez has gained maximum impact from the loan market is a positive - the end.

You wanting to highlight that it doesn't excuse the lack of player investment from the club, is one thing - seeking to turn it into some form of negative all round is truly sad.

How is saying that a constant carousel of loan signings year in, year out is a highly risky strategy and based on short termism anything other than a reasonable and self-evident point?

I think it's more a case of those taking a Pollyanna view that all is rosy in the garden who are being more *sad*.

How have we come to this point in our history when we see this model as a step in the right direction? I'll tell you how: 14 years of utter dumbing down of Evertonian expectations under Billy Liar and his assortment of spivs he's trailed through the club with him.

 

[Foot Long Hot Dog]

In their case it's to deepen the squad. They'll be by no means first teamers week in week out that they'll be struggling to cope without next season.

Liverpool are in a completely different boat to us. They can keep star players and play the loan market at luxury. We, on the other hand, are going to be highly dependent on loan players. We're far less stable as a consequence.

The ****e's 2 loan players cost over £20m the pair, they're hardly kids & I'm sure their parent clubs expected them to get plenty of game time.

Deulofeu wasn't signed as a first team player ffs, he wasn't even expected to get much game time until the New Year. Barry won't be gong back to his parent club. Only Lukaku has plugged a hole where we couldn't afford the quality that we would ideally want.

 

[Foot Long Hot Dog]

How is saying that a constant carousel of loan signings year in, year out is a highly risky strategy and based on short termism anything other than a reasonable and self-evident point?

I think it's more a case of those taking a Pollyanna view that all is rosy in the garden who are being more *sad*.

How have we come to this point in our history when we see this model as a step in the right direction? I'll tell you how: 14 years of utter dumbing down of Evertonian expectations under Billy Liar and his assortment of spivs he's trailed through the club with him.

No-one's said everything is rosy. However some of us have a sense of perspective & can allow ourselves to see a positive where there patently is one.

 

[milkshock]

It's no good trying to make a virtue out of a necessity. It's something we have to do (and we have a manager who can be flexible and operate that way), but it's a recipe for treading water.

We have people in control of the club who are letting us down badly. Regardless of the obvious fact that they have not (and will not) put a penny into the club themselves, there is huge amounts of cash coming into Everton from tv revenue and player sales, but the manager is not getting the benefit. It's either diverted into some arcane costing on the accounts or simply credited to paying down debts that never seem to get any smaller year on year.

This loan strategy just underlines how poorly run and off the pace we are as an organisation.

Bang on.

 

[davek]

No-one's said everything is rosy. However some of us have a sense of perspective & can allow ourselves to see a positive where there patently is one.

I have perspective too. It allows me to see an, at best, sideways move as a sideways move and not the great leap forward.

 

[milkshock]

I have perspective too. It allows me to see an, at best, sideways move as a sideways move and not the great leap forward.

Dave do you see any of the following happening:

A - Baines new contract
B - Ross new contract
C - lukaku staying next season
D - barca kid staying next season

I see none of the above occurring personally

 

[Pabbers]

If you just look at the 'improving players for other teams' poinit, then yes it is a bit naff.

But people / media say we are doing that with players we own anyway....just see the Barkley stuff around.

If we would have brought the Spanish kid through our system, we prob wouldn't have had him 2 full seasons in the senior squad without him getting flogged, when it looks like we could have him a full 2 years via this loan system.

The system is their to be used, and we are using it like a whore.....but expect it to be changed now we have shown you can actually beat the big spenders this way!!

It makes me not get too attached to our players, knowing they will be gone soon(ish).

We have to be honest, we cant compete with purchasing players, so are we expected to just do nothing ??

 

[milkshock]

If you just look at the 'improving players for other teams' poinit, then yes it is a bit naff.

But people / media say we are doing that with players we own anyway....just see the Barkley stuff around.

If we would have brought the Spanish kid through our system, we prob wouldn't have had him 2 full seasons in the senior squad without him getting flogged, when it looks like we could have him a full 2 years via this loan system.

The system is their to be used, and we are using it like a whore.....but expect it to be changed now we have shown you can actually beat the big spenders this way!!

It makes me not get too attached to our players, knowing they will be gone soon(ish).

We have to be honest, we cant compete with purchasing players, so are we expected to just do nothing ??

There is absolutely no reason with a proper chairman and board at the helm that we should not be competing for purchasing players