Where and when did it all start going awry for us?

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Oh they would still exist, they will never be eradicated.

Imagine Badge Man or Dr Fun in blue, doesn't bare thinking about.

Interesting thought though, if liverpool didnt exist would Bootle have stayed at the level they were at and would they be our big rivals now instead?
Bootle, hard as it is to believe, by all accounts they were even worse than the rs are now.
 
Also a shout for the Directors back in the 30s who changes the voting from 1 man 1 vote to 500 shares = 500 vote and 1000 shares = 1000 votes etc.
Effectively ending true democracy and starting the 'Ive got much more money than yow, so my voice matters more and my opinion is righter than yours' thing.
 
I think in hindsight Bill Kenwright ...

He favours sentimentality over ruthlessness
He wants to have an authentic little historical club, but we're in a commercial era
(and they never worked out that you can make both of them work together)
Somehow, there's a plucky little Everton loser mentality across the entire club, which even managers, coaches and A list players cannot change
So the club culture comes from the owner and CEO - or in our case the board - so I think Kenwright has been the only constant when we've changed other personnel at every level.
 

An interesting piece. This was penned in 2017 and signed off in the hope that Moshiri and Koeman(with emerging talent like Davies) lead Everton to a brighter future.
Now we have Carlo and Brands!!


PS-This page also has other nice pieces on Dixie Dean and Kendall. Well worth pursuing.
 

It was a number of things. 1) Hysel without question 2) Kendall leaving. Still dont understand that one. I know hes a legend but why as an Evertonian did he leave. 3) Mismanagement. The degree to which we have been has been staggering. 4) Moyes. He did really well and we played some great stuff under him at times but the longer he stayed the more negative he became. Maybe things could have been different but at vital times (Semi v Liverpool) he bottled it. He did that many times.
 
I think in hindsight Bill Kenwright ...

He favours sentimentality over ruthlessness
He wants to have an authentic little historical club, but we're in a commercial era
(and they never worked out that you can make both of them work together)
Somehow, there's a plucky little Everton loser mentality across the entire club, which even managers, coaches and A list players cannot change
So the club culture comes from the owner and CEO - or in our case the board - so I think Kenwright has been the only constant when we've changed other personnel at every level.
Agree
 

No doubt I will get hammered for this , but...

As a Red but with a lot of time for Everton, I can't help when I read these posts that people need to move on.

Heysel was awful and a disgrace which I am ashamed of. Yes it punished the innocent and in particular Everton. You might have got onto a cycle of European success and been in a better place to attract and keep the best players.

BUT IT WAS THIRTY THREE YEARS AGO.

If you want to keep going back to it nothing will be fixed. There have been plenty of opportunities and wrong turns since then. Fans telling themselves players, coaches and managers were better than they were. But maybe more importantly, not enough fight.

Remember Liverpool less than six years ago were under Hicks and Gilette. Full of debt. Settling for second-best and claiming it was world-class. Dragging Dalglish out of retirement for yet another try.

H and G ran out of road financially, but as important was that the fans made it clear this was not the club they loved. They marched, they demonstrated, they hammered the phone-ins, and made them very much aware they expected better.

Come on guys. Speak up.

You have a fine manager. He didn't have to come to Everton. He must have known it was a big job, He needs dramatic support from the club and you can play your part in demanding it too. Otherwise I think he might walk.

And a question...is Liverpool big enough for TWO top clubs? Manchester is, but I have my doubts here.
Couple of fair points. Mindset (negativity) is a big player at our club.I think we have to move on from the Hysel thing but it was a major factor, however the biggest is mismanagement since.
 
I only started going the game in 1998 so can't really comment on the 70s and 80s.

But in my lifetime 2 big moments stand out.

1. The Collina decision against Villareal that others have mentioned

2. One that nobody has mentioned, this game: https://www.bbc.com/sport/football/26716889

If we had won that game we would have been in the driving seat for 4th with just a few games left, it all went tits up for Martinez in the end but that first season we were really good. If we had finished in the top 4 that year who knows what would have happened
 
1892 with the afterbirth. No seriously in the aftermath of Heysel, so Kendall left in 87, we started to droop. Harvey wasn't the right man and we had a version of the last 5 years in the early 90's. That's when it went awry. What all this meant was the mismanagement from top to bottom in this period (you could argue like recent years) led to our decline as a club when Sky arrived. Ironically Carter was involved in the breakaway PL. The 'big 5'. We're very lucky that we've not gone down. We're still a big club to me but we have to shift the mid table mediocrity image and start winning trophies and challenging at the top and in Europe if we're to be taken seriously again.
 

An interesting piece. This was penned in 2017 and signed off in the hope that Moshiri and Koeman(with emerging talent like Davies) lead Everton to a brighter future.
Now we have Carlo and Brands!!


PS-This page also has other nice pieces on Dixie Dean and Kendall. Well worth pursuing.

That whole site is really good,
Some amazing articles about all aspects of football
I particularly like the articles about South American footy
 

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