2019/20 Moise Kean

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No, most people are quite rightly questioning the performances of a first team player earning first team wages. They were right to do the same to others who weren’t performing aswell, and someone like Holgate starting to improve over the last couple of months doesn’t mean it was wrong to question him. He’s still got a lot to do to prove he’s good enough to be our main centre half for years to come. A tiny minority are advocating selling Kean now, many more people are suggesting that expecting him to have contributed anything at all in 6 months is absurd and unfair.

There's no doubt he was brought in to have an impact this season and that just hasn't happened. He has been no better than Sandro Ramirez. We can hope things turn round and they might, but in terms of impact, it couldn't have gone any worse so far.
 
No, most people are quite rightly questioning the performances of a first team player earning first team wages. They were right to do the same to others who weren’t performing aswell, and someone like Holgate starting to improve over the last couple of months doesn’t mean it was wrong to question him. He’s still got a lot to do to prove he’s good enough to be our main centre half for years to come. A tiny minority are advocating selling Kean now, many more people are suggesting that expecting him to have contributed anything at all in 6 months is absurd and unfair.
The way you post it sounds like people are making reasoned well thought-out posts about his performance, whereas in reality people are just ripping into him without any consideration of context. Just a quick look back over the last 5-6 pages of this thread would have show a majority against him impatient to have him sold and never to be seen in our shirt again. It's a fact that 19 year-olds are very rarely the finished article. It's counter productive to treat them as such IMO
 
No, most people are quite rightly questioning the performances of a first team player earning first team wages. They were right to do the same to others who weren’t performing aswell, and someone like Holgate starting to improve over the last couple of months doesn’t mean it was wrong to question him. He’s still got a lot to do to prove he’s good enough to be our main centre half for years to come. A tiny minority are advocating selling Kean now, many more people are suggesting that expecting him to have contributed anything at all in 6 months is absurd and unfair.

That’s not at all the tone of this thread.
 

Everyone wants to sign young players with potential, no one wants to patient and allow these lads to fulfill potential.

I think its clear the lad has quality, he needs time. We might not see the best of him for 2 seasons, so be it.

You have to back the plan really, else wise whats the point.

If the plan is to give 3 years to young players who are playing badly in the hope they come good then we need to come up with a new way of doing things. Possibly the biggest clubs in the world can spend £30m on someone to see them do nothing in 6 months, but even then there'd be huge question marks.

You also have to think about the fact that Kean himself will probably be looking for a way out to kick start his career again. It's a huge second half of the season for him, make no mistake.
 
Just got to be patient. The whole squad is crap and we need to improve everywhere. I’m sure he will improve with time as the squad improves. I really don’t get people’s problem, did they expect him to be Mbappe or something?
 
If the plan is to give 3 years to young players who are playing badly in the hope they come good then we need to come up with a new way of doing things. Possibly the biggest clubs in the world can spend £30m on someone to see them do nothing in 6 months, but even then there'd be huge question marks.

You also have to think about the fact that Kean himself will probably be looking for a way out to kick start his career again. It's a huge second half of the season for him, make no mistake.

I dont think we do, if that is the direction we have decided to go in, you have to back it in my opinion.

I see the folly being with us as a fan base, our expectations were out the window with this lad, there was no way a 19 year old with few senior appearances was ever coming here to shoot the lights out and be a starter straight of the bat.

The reasons i see for Kean not being successful thus far and depleting factors are as follows:

Age: I think you are looking at incremental progress season on season. Look at Richarlison and DCL they are 3 years older and 3/4 seasons into their PL careers and are now only hitting 15 goal a season averages. They have incrementally improved season on season in their careers. Kean needs the time to do this and will do in my opinion.

Fitness and Athleticism: I think depleting aspects for Kean have been, its a new league i dont think his fitness or athleticism or his development thus far has equipped him for the PL. I dont see much wrong with his technique, talent, quality and natural attributes. His fitness and athleticism is something that can be changed - a full preseason will do him wonders. He signed quite late in the window and didn't have a preseason of fitness or S/C with us.

New League: Its a whole new league for him very different to Serie A.

Quality of team mates, when you say other teams will sign a 19 year old and will score loads, well yes if Kean was playing up front for City he would probably get about 10 coming of the bench due the quality of their players and the chances they create. We dont have that quality unfortunately.

Unstable environment: Hes joined a club that has changed managers mid season and all the instability that creates, in a squad that has and will see an awful lot of turnover and is the mis-mash of being kind four to five different managers.

Style of play: He strikes me as a pacy of the shoulder, direct running, dribbling center forward, even an inside forward right or left. We are so conditioned into playing a big unit up front leading the line, that i think we dont often play to his strengths or actually know how to or have or identify players of his skill set, hes different to what we have and what we are used to.

League position: We need points and we need results, but Kean needs adjustment those two things arent congruent at the moment thus his opportunities and fitting in are hampered.

I definitely feel he has the quality, but i do think what we will see is season on season incremental improvement. Hes shooting the lights out against his peers at U21 level with Italy and we know hes done it at senior elsewhere, all that bodes well.

I think the folly lies with us as a fan base in expecting to much beyond logic can deliver, the club has been massively unstable since he has been here, its not a great or stable environment to come into at the moment, but im confident in him as a player. I always look at a player and back the quality they show i see it in this lad, but it needs to be honed.

We need to be patient with him, i think he will improve next season, with stability a full preseason and us better understanding him he will improve incrementally. Hes an investment and its in our interests to develop him. I think we will.

Many back Brands on here and if this is the strategy he is going and you believe in him, you have to accept the above in my opinion. Im in two minds on Brands but i think if you have a plan you have to back it and stick with it else wise what is the point in him.

We need to control our expectations, why so much pressure on Kean and not on someone like Braitwaite or Gordon they are all still in and around the same age and development cycle but all judged very differently in terms of expectations.
 
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he isn't going to get better sat on the bench so he gets some time and I think we'd all agree on the principal that he'll need to adapt, he's just taking longer than we's all like. Look at this season as a free hit for him, next season is where we start to expect a significant improvement
 
The way you post it sounds like people are making reasoned well thought-out posts about his performance, whereas in reality people are just ripping into him without any consideration of context. Just a quick look back over the last 5-6 pages of this thread would have show a majority against him impatient to have him sold and never to be seen in our shirt again. It's a fact that 19 year-olds are very rarely the finished article. It's counter productive to treat them as such IMO
So you don’t think these posts over the last 5-6 pages are reasonable?

I’ve said before that I’d never really seen him before he signed for us. I’d seen clips and heard his name but never actually seen him in a game.

Based on the way people talked about him I expected a season a bit like Rooney’s debut one; only half a dozen or so goals and not many 90 minute performances, but leaving you in no doubt that he’s a star. The lower end of the spectrum I expected would be deulofeu’s first season, where he ultimately flattered to deceive, but when he was good he was mesmerising. What I’m actually seeing is a lad who has struggled to even look like a functional option in a mid table side. It ain’t pretty.

Again, he’ll get all the time in the world from me at the match, but I can’t dress it up on here, he looks a million miles from what I thought we were getting.
i thought he started brightly, much more involved than DCL but he faded out of the game 2nd half and gave the ball away cheaply. I think there’s A confidence issue there aswell. Let’s have some patience with the lad. He’s got plenty of time on his side.
I'm entitled to an opinion mate. Relax. Tosun scored against City today. Kean didn't do much. I'm not against Kean, I want him to succeed, but I don't see it. It is not controversial to state an opinion about a player, even if they are not getting enough minutes to make a full evaluation. People did this with Sandro, Klassen, etc., etc., Not sure what merited you giving me the finger in a previous post except your own pettiness.
The more the weeks go by the more underwhelming this signing gets.
Not expecting much from him based on the little we've seen. Hopefully he gets a decent pre season under his belt and can start to impress.
If not ship him out next Jan or even the end of August if a decent offer comes in.
I think Moise Kean should go out on loan to a championship club and get some game time. He has the physical aspects, but he needs to work on his game immensely. Yesterday it was as if, he didn't know where to run most of the time, and his lack of communication and teamwork with Walcott and DLC was obvious. When he did get it, he'd lose it through a bad touch or pass. I think he needs to control his temperament as well, otherwise his teammates are going to get sick of it.
Needs games definitely not match fit, you need a run of games for that, I'd play him next 4 or 5, if he doesn't show nothing at the end of that.....then I would worry.
Yeah, it is but realistically 5 years of what we've seen from him until now isn't going to happen. I maintain what I've said in the past. He will have until next January to show us what he's got then it'll be best for both parties if he moves somewhere else, at least on loan.
I think his price tag has definitely fast forwarded the frustration of some fans which is understandable near 30m is a lot of money but we're hoping his clear and obvious talent shines through so he can become a 70-80m player in 2/3 or 4 years.
his work rate is better than it was a few games ago, I'm still in the 'give him time' camp.
He's only made 4 league starts as of yet.

His adjustment may be painfully slow, but his situation isn't like Niasse who was playing games straight away, fully fit and being absolutely horrific. Kean started here nowhere near fit and has clearly had trouble adjusting to the English game, which is understandable given the league he came from, language skills and his age.

The reality is that this entire season was always going to be about getting him settled. That has cost us enormously as it's meant we've had to play DCL up front all season and means questions should be asked of Marcel Brands i.e. just what did he think Kean was going to deliver this season/what we were going to look like up front if he wasn't quite ready.

I still don't think he's 100% fit yet and it's difficult to judge him as what we've seen of him so far is a nervous, unsure Kean, lacking in confidence. We're yet to see a confident, bullish Kean, who'd probably be twice the player we're watching currently. Getting there is up to him, mind. But he clearly needs more game time than he's had so far.

That’s just the ones that could be construed as vaguely critical, there’s far more than that which are 100% supportive and blaming everyone but him for what’s happened. If they’re not reasonable what would be, in your opinion? Is it crossing a line to question a players performances on a forum now? Or are you going to claim that you knew all along that the new £27m striker the club crowed about signing would only complete 90 minutes once in his first 6 months of the season?
 

That’s not at all the tone of this thread.
Isn’t it? Actually read the posts, maybe you’ll change your mind. The very next post after yours is someone suggesting that there were only 2 possible ways this could have gone, him not scoring at all and him being mbappe. Haha dead right lad, not like people are just thinking he might have looked reasonably threatening and scored a couple of goals, everyone who’s concerned by what they’ve seen can only have been expecting him to score 50 goals. It’s utterly mental how some people just refuse to accept that he has - up until now - been massively disappointing. Doesn’t mean he won’t come good, doesn’t mean he’s a bad lad or he’s not trying or it’s the worst thing ever to happen, but let’s not pretend that if someone had told you in August we’d be playing 2 up front and Kean wouldn’t be one of them you’d have believed them.
 
So you don’t think these posts over the last 5-6 pages are reasonable?













That’s just the ones that could be construed as vaguely critical, there’s far more than that which are 100% supportive and blaming everyone but him for what’s happened. If they’re not reasonable what would be, in your opinion? Is it crossing a line to question a players performances on a forum now? Or are you going to claim that you knew all along that the new £27m striker the club crowed about signing would only complete 90 minutes once in his first 6 months of the season?
There are a few unreasonable ones in there.
 
Isn’t it? Actually read the posts, maybe you’ll change your mind. The very next post after yours is someone suggesting that there were only 2 possible ways this could have gone, him not scoring at all and him being mbappe. Haha dead right lad, not like people are just thinking he might have looked reasonably threatening and scored a couple of goals, everyone who’s concerned by what they’ve seen can only have been expecting him to score 50 goals. It’s utterly mental how some people just refuse to accept that he has - up until now - been massively disappointing. Doesn’t mean he won’t come good, doesn’t mean he’s a bad lad or he’s not trying or it’s the worst thing ever to happen, but let’s not pretend that if someone had told you in August we’d be playing 2 up front and Kean wouldn’t be one of them you’d have believed them.

*reads posts*
Get him off the pitch
I'm not joking and I bet a fair few would agree but I'd rather have niasse starting over kean right now
Another tripe Brands signing.
off to Cagliari on monday, has to learn a lot.
Omar junior up to now
should ship him on loan to Leeds
Think we can all admit now we have a donkey on our hands. Terrible in and out of possession today.
Another wasted opportunity.

Loan him out. To sun scoring against city today is typical Everton.
Well I’m not one of them. We persisted too long with DCL and he is, at best, average. Kean is just awful. No touch, no vision, no pace. Niasse is just a fraud of a footballer taking the club to the cleaners.
Truly awful player, another Brands dud
Get him back to Italy and take the loss. Use the cash brought in to fund another attacker.

Cant believe we retained this divvy and got shut of Tosun....who is NOT the answer, but he;s far more convncing than this lad.


Get all your diamond and gold watches together, stick them in your bags and leave this club.
There's nothing there. Another 5 years with this lad will relegate us.
Got his work cut out to get to that huge target of 7 goals hasn't he?

Any chance his ma can take him back please ?

The fanfare and gloating over getting this lad make the fact he's utter pony even worse.
Niasse looked better than him.

I'm not saying Niasse is better than him, but it says it all about the impact Kean has made as a footballer at Ebeptov.

He needs to improve dramatically - and quickly - if he's not to be moved on in the summer. For me, he just seems to be the type of footballer that doesn't suit English football.
I'm disappointed in what I'm seeing. Talent is clear but the application is not there at all.
He's had quite a few. It's not looking good so far.
Lukaku > Richarlison in just about every department other than heading.

Kean - he's appalling. 19? So what?
This exactly....he is showing zero right now which warrants a right for patience. He was bought from Juventus with a few decent words from some Italian journalists we know nothing about. And some people trust brands which means there must be something there apparently. If we are judging him on what we have seen, there is nothing there. His touch is awful, he can’t dribble, he regularly gives the ball away when he has time on the ball. He’s dreadful with his back to goal and he doesn’t get himself in any goal scoring opportunities. I’d like to see his stats overall (they never seem to be shown btw) of his pass completion rate, dribbles and how many shots he’s had since he’s been here. I want this guy to be good as much as anyone on here but I am seeing nothing to suggest there is a good footballer there. The DCL comparisons are not valid also. He cost next to nothing and was showing something. He was a nuisance, was an outlet in the air. Could play the channels, even when he wasn’t scoring. Kean does none of that.
Because he is the reckless driving love-child of Sandro and Niasse.

Nope, haven’t changed my mind.
 

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